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View Full Version : do u ever call a girl on a lie when it's about plans u made...



eFlow
04-2006-15, 01:11 PM
the scenario...I was talking to this chick online and I asked her if she wanted to go to the gym with me...she said yeah but she has to ask her mom (which I do belive to be true cause she has to ask her mom to do n e thing, lol, yeah first red flag but whatever) so then she dissapears...I call her like an hour later and she doesn't answer...
then next time we talk, the next day...she goes...immidelity...sorry my computer died and my internet was down...I respond "it's alright" then she goes "and my phone died too" (when it rang so obviosly it wasn't dead, or it would of went striaght to VM) anyways I changed the subject right after that and siad "do u like nickelback" (lol, I was just listening to them and didn't know what else to say)
but I was thinking of saying something like "do must guy but that excuse" but then I thought that would sound unconident and insecure, but then again i'm pretty sure she was lying about the phone and possibly the comp/inter crash...
did I play that alright...? should I ever bring up the "gym" again, i'm pretty sure I could get her to go with me but since I already kinda got shut down once I'm not sure if I should try again...

Paddy
04-2006-15, 01:39 PM
I would have just gone to the gym and not bothered calling her that first time.

Rain
04-2006-15, 01:40 PM
Women lie. They lie more than men. They do it because the social convention of sparing someone's feelings weighs heavily on them. They think that by lying, they are saving you from some bad feeling.
Or it's just easier for them. Even more social pressures demand that women have legitimate reasons for their actions. But, because they are ruled by emotion and often irrational, explaining their motives for action or inaction can be exhausting. Therefore, through reinforcement over time, they have learned that a lie is just easier than the truth. They don't realize that we often misinterpret their 'white lies' as directed and full of intent. They see lying as a survival tool with no real consequences.
When you catch a woman in a lie, if it is about something as mundane as the gym, just let it go. The only time you should call her on it is when the subject of the lie matters to you. This does not include those needy moments when everything she does matters to you. The question you should ask yourself, when deciding how to deal with the lie is: "Would I care about this if I weren't thinking about having sex with this person?"

Dr_Swift
04-2006-15, 02:09 PM
Never EVER let it pass.
Call her on it.
Bust on her for it.
Do it in a fun way, but let her KNOW you get it AND let her see it doesn't bother you one bit by teasing her.
It communicates that you've got other options and it communicates that you understand what's going on.
She's lying to avoid hurting you and saying 'I don't want to' OR saying 'You're just too much of a wussy-nice-guy but I don't want to hurt you.

eFlow
04-2006-15, 04:15 PM
Never EVER let it pass.
Call her on it.
Bust on her for it.
Do it in a fun way, but let her KNOW you get it AND let her see it doesn't bother you one bit by teasing her.
It communicates that you've got other options and it communicates that you understand what's going on.
She's lying to avoid hurting you and saying 'I don't want to' OR saying 'You're just too much of a wussy-nice-guy but I don't want to hurt you.
idea's or examples on calling her on the lie...like what exactly would one say in the situation I was in...

eFlow
04-2006-15, 05:08 PM
The question you should ask yourself, when deciding how to deal with the lie is: "Would I care about this if I weren't thinking about having sex with this person?"
so ur saying when the answer is "no" (for the most part) it's not advised to call her on the lie...

doc
04-2006-15, 05:34 PM
call her on her shit...
kid shit...
' if you did`nt want to go ...just say so.'
done.

Rakly
04-2006-15, 05:54 PM
call her on her shit...
kid shit...
' if you did`nt want to go ...just say so.'
done.
I'd go for a more neutral approach at first.
Say "You don't have to lie to me." but in a calm understanding manner.
She will 99.9% of the time reply that she isn't lieing, respond backt o her "I know you're not" and drop the whole case. Don't mention it again.
She'll know what it means and puts you in the controling position.
The more you can genuenly catch them on small lies like this, the more respect you'll be getting.
edit: Oh and btw, if they DO start telling you the truth, don't punish them by yelling and stuff, that will only force them back to lieing. Be reasonable and talk it over.
(lol, this is like giving parents advice on how to rase children hehehe)

Scooby
04-2006-15, 08:19 PM
My two cents: If its minor in nature (like the gym thing in your case), let it go - you dont want to be the sort of guy that lets little things get to him. If its a biggie call her on it.

Dr. Zeus
04-2006-15, 08:28 PM
I think you did the right thing. Just let it go and forget about it. Hopefully she'll forget about it also. I'd rather not remind a chick that she blew me off. That'll get her backwards rationalizing things.
Women don't like to feel incongruent with their self images. And even the shiftiest of women don't consider themselves shifty. She'll rationalize things to sustain her self image, and end up telling herself, I blew him off because I didn't like him.

Rain
04-2006-15, 11:37 PM
To everyone who says, "Call her on it."
WHY?
How is making her feel bad going to help you out? Why alienate her? Calling her on it will only make her avoid you in the future to avoid embarassment. If you don't have trust and comfort, then you don't have the kind of rapport necessary to "tell it like it is."
If your FB or GF lies to you in this way, sure, go ahead and call her on it, if it matters. But to an HB, the lie is less about you than it is about her. Refer to my post above for reasons why.
Exactly how do you guys propose to continue sarging a girl after calling her on an inconsequential lie? How do you call her on it without projecting outcome dependence and neediness? How do you explain your mistrust to her? How do you gain her trust after that?
If you have trust and comfort with a woman, you can have expectations of honesty. If you're still working on Attraction or Comfort, you have not developed enough of a relationship to expect honesty. Especially when it concerns something so trivial.
What are you going to say? "Hey, I know you lied to me about your cell phone and computer. I'm not cool with that. So, you want to get some coffee with me?" Give me a break.
eFlow, think about it for a minute. Why would she be so quick to fabricate an elaborate lie about not calling you back? Was it because she didn't want to go out with you? That doesn't make sense. If she didn't like you, she wouldn't be bothered explaining it to you. She'd just avoid you until you give up.
Instead, what probably happened was that she had some irrational reason for not getting back to you. She thought about it afterwards and realized she regretted not meeting you. So she had to make herself helpless in her story, a victim. That way she'd spare your feelings and save herself the trouble of explaining her irrational choices to you.
Dr. Zeus has got it right. The rest of you, get your heads right. There is a time for standing up to a woman. This isn't one of them.
This isn't the war between the sexes, us versus them. This is more like a diplomatic mission.
You can always tease her about it after you've been sleeping together for a while. "Haha, I remember that time you told me a little white lie. You were so cute, trying to get away with it. You sooo wanted me." Then give her a noogie.

actives
04-2006-16, 05:02 AM
Anyway... I also second that IT'S NOT WORTH calling out a girl on a lie. Besides what Rain mentioned, it just shows you CARE TOO MUCH. Quite frankly, in reality, you shouldn't be caring too much, anyway. If you guys are in a serious, deep, committed relationship, and she lies big time, then you got some problems...
Additionally, when you confront a girl on a little white lie, you're overreacting. It'll tell the girl you're not socially calibrated enough to know how to react to simple scenarios, and you just can't retain composure.
Think about when your friends say they don't want to come out. You call them a loser behind their back underneath your breath and call it a day. lol They'll be around for the next time, so what should it matter? Same thing with women. Unless you continue to screw up things royally, they'll be around the next time.
To further this thought, the best way to prevent women from lying/flaking is to make sure you're laying solid game on her.

legonz
04-2006-16, 05:11 AM
I would have just cut the conversation off right there.
"Yeah. Gotta go."
Let HER wonder about whether or not you bought it.

eFlow
04-2006-16, 02:20 PM
right, sounds good, thanks guys...

Sovereign
04-2006-16, 02:41 PM
If you must for whatever reason continue a relationship with someone who lied to you like that, than a cocky funny,
"So, I'd ask you to get coffee or something, but then I am sure you would have to ask your mom, and while you are asking her I am sure your phone would lose all battery charge, while at the same moment your computer will for some unknown reason just shut down for days.....so it seems like it would cause you way to many problems...."

Savoy
04-2006-17, 10:21 AM
The last issue of the OAP dealt with this - for about 5 pages. I personally think the OAP should be mandatory for anyone on the forum

Aequitas
04-2006-17, 09:52 PM
The last issue of the OAP dealt with this - for about 5 pages. I personally think the OAP should be mandatory for anyone on the forum
I'm signed up for the OAP, but haven't got an issue in some time. Any reports of this?

Dr_Swift
04-2006-18, 02:57 AM
You've got to call her on it in the right way. If you act hurt etc. it plain won't work.
I'd bust on her for it. The trick is to let her see you know it's bullshit without actually telling her. Also to show that you don't care one bit that it's bullshit.
To be honest if this happens a lot some areas of your game need work ;-)
A girl recently flaked out on making dinner for me (giving a BS excuse) I told her:
' It's ok, I wasn't trying to embarass you. If you couldn't cook you should just have admitted it'
Point is it's not 100% serious but it shows that you're not buying into her bs.

Cedar
04-2006-18, 05:31 AM
...do u ever call a girl on a lie when it's about plans u made...
Why do you care if she flakes or not? You have some kind of emotional investment in the girl? This is outcome dependence. You got a half dozen quality timebridges that evening, right? Call all of them the next day to respark attraction, build comfort and solidyf the timebridge.
The more you do this the less you'll see flakes. And never call them on flaking. That's what guys do that aren't getting laid.
And read the OAP. It covers how to prevent this in depth.

MoneynStyle
04-2006-18, 06:27 AM
My two cents: If its minor in nature (like the gym thing in your case), let it go - you dont want to be the sort of guy that lets little things get to him. If its a biggie call her on it.
I think you need to call her on it either way. No matter what she lies about, you've gotta bust her on it AND act like it doesn't bother you. 2 Things accomplished by doing it this way.

Cedar
04-2006-18, 07:19 AM
I think you need to call her on it either way. No matter what she lies about, you've gotta bust her on it AND act like it doesn't bother you. 2 Things accomplished by doing it this way.
I disagree. I wouldn't acknowledge this behaviour at all. Too easy for busting to come off try hard. Ignore and plow. Unless you're REAL good at banter and don't find screwing this up a dozen times before you get it calibrated.

Masters
04-2006-18, 07:29 AM
If you must for whatever reason continue a relationship with someone who lied to you like that, than a cocky funny,
"So, I'd ask you to get coffee or something, but then I am sure you would have to ask your mom, and while you are asking her I am sure your phone would lose all battery charge, while at the same moment your computer will for some unknown reason just shut down for days.....so it seems like it would cause you way to many problems...."
haha


Don’t be upset. Don’t lecture her. She doesn’t care. All you’ll succeed in doing is making her momentarily feel badly. She’ll feel better once the next guy gives her attention, and she’ll associate negative feelings with you. Remember, she’s cancelling because she’s not that into you yet. [99% of the time, this is the case. Would she be cancelling if it were Brad Pitt?]. Making her feel badly is only going to make her less into you.
Just in case that wasn’t clear. You planned to meet a girl at 6? You had to leave work early? Fight traffic? Cut your workout short? Miss your favorite show? Tough. She doesn’t care. That’s not her problem. If you tell her all of this, you just look like even more of a tool because you rearranged your life for a date with her.
Act like a guy who has lots of women interested in him and pursuing him. If that was you, and a girl flaked, your reaction would be “OK cool” because you have lots of other girls who would love to see you and more than likely whatever it was you were going to do was something you were going to be doing anyway with cool friends. If you don’t think you have that attitude down properly, try cancelling the next time you set up a first date with a random girl. Listen for her casual reaction. It didn’t ruin her day. It shouldn’t ruin yours.
A phrase I’ve had a lot of success with (credit Savoy) is “No problem, I’ll invite someone else”. Obviously don’t use this on a third or fourth date, but when it’s still casual, it’s perfect.

Sign Up for the OAP HERE! (http://www.theattractionforums.com/)

MoneynStyle
04-2006-18, 07:55 AM
Cedar/Masters - If you let her lie to you and you play stupid and dont make notice of it, then thats when you are a tool. I'm not saying whine and complain. If she lies, just bust her (jokingly) and then move on. 2 Things are accomplished in that
1) You are smart and know when she is lying, you dont appreciate someone flakey.
2) By joking with her and moving on, you seem layed back and dont care too much which DHV's.
Just dont overcompensate,, guys. Realistically you only want to spend about 5-10 seconds on the entire thing. If you dont bust her and joke, then you're the tool and she just played you like she does every guy.

Masters
04-2006-18, 08:07 AM
If you let her lie to you and you play stupid and dont make notice of it, then thats when you are a tool. I'm not saying whine and complain. If she lies, just bust her (jokingly) and then move on.
Actually, you are a tool if you need to bust on her for canceling on you because you care enough to give her a bad time about it. "jokingly" giving her a hard time is still giving her a hard time. You don't care if she cancels, next time you'll just call someone who doesn't have an EMP hit their house.
But then again, I'm sure the advice from the ACTUAL pua's doesn't really mean shit because they're all tools right? :D
This also assumes you CAN have someone else go out with you instead next time. Obviously a guy's value isn't high enough to the girl if she's going to flake like this and there are other issues here than just this emp.

Rain
04-2006-18, 08:41 AM
Cedar/Masters - If you let her lie to you and you play stupid and dont make notice of it, then thats when you are a tool. I'm not saying whine and complain. If she lies, just bust her (jokingly) and then move on. 2 Things are accomplished in that
1) You are smart and know when she is lying, you dont appreciate someone flakey.
2) By joking with her and moving on, you seem layed back and dont care too much which DHV's.
Just dont overcompensate,, guys. Realistically you only want to spend about 5-10 seconds on the entire thing. If you dont bust her and joke, then you're the tool and she just played you like she does every guy.
Understanding WHY she lies is key to changing this particular perception. If you take it personally, and respond accordingly, you are investing too much into the girl.
Doesn't anybody read the previous posts? Or is always Thread Topic-Post Reply?

MoneynStyle
04-2006-18, 08:53 AM
Well these are forums. Forums are a place for people to discuss different viewpoints I believe. Personally I'd bust her because it DHV's you and sets you apart from any retard who didn't realize she lied. I see your perspectives and I do understand why you wouldn't bust her, I agree with that as well if done in the proper context. You could talk about your foot fungus for 3 hours straight and come out looking like the man if you did it right. Whatever you say just needs to fit your personality properly.

Cedar
04-2006-18, 08:54 AM
Understanding WHY she lies is key to changing this particular perception...
Don't spend time trying to understand WHY the emotionally-driven and yet stunning beautiful creature we call woman does ANYTHING. They ain't logical like we is. Expect this behaviour and blow it off by having more than one fish in the barrell. And feel free to amply return the favour to random girls by flaking now and then. It's what high value people do.

Rain
04-2006-18, 09:06 AM
Don't spend time trying to understand WHY the emotionally-driven and yet stunning beautiful creature we call woman does ANYTHING. They ain't logical like we is. Expect this behaviour and blow it off by having more than one fish in the barrell. And feel free to amply return the favour to random girls by flaking now and then. It's what high value people do.
When an APUA is operating under a system of limiting beliefs, it is essential for them to discover why things are different than they appear in order to value changing their beliefs. That's why Mystery and LoveDrop spent so much time explaining women's behavior in the VAH.
People aggressively defend their habits and frames, however misquided. They have to be given a reason to see things another way. That's all I'm saying. When it comes to each individual situation, with every girl, I agree with you. But in order to do that effectively with all women, you've got to understand why nearly all women do this.

Savoy
04-2006-18, 10:18 AM
I'm signed up for the OAP, but haven't got an issue in some time. Any reports of this?
Email katie@mysterymethod.com if you don't have the most recent OAP. Check also that you have added @mysterymethod.com to your safe domains list. A lot of time our stuff ends up in junk mail folders

eFlow
04-2006-18, 02:29 PM
wow, confusing...