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jbrett
03-22-2006, 01:19 PM
A few times when I've run opinion openers, especially on 2+ sets in public non-drinking places I get the suspicious "why are you asking us this?" While I've got an answer already in place, they still have this "why us?" attitude that makes it hard even to attempt to shift the conversation to something else. I know you guys have delt with this, tell me whats up

flava flav
03-22-2006, 01:36 PM
Happens to me sometimes too mate, it's just about getting them comfortable with you. If all else fails what I do is tell them I need to go back to my friends, and give them a slight 'unsociable' neg. Then if you see them later, maybe try again.

obie
03-22-2006, 01:50 PM
Remember to FTC and root the opener.
I used to open pretty well wthout rooting, just being authoritative, but rooting is more solid I've found, especially for opinion openers.
Try this
" hey guys quick question, I can only stay a second I'm looking for my friends, but we've been discussing this and need you guys to help settle a debate"-->opinion opener
Remeber come in confident, strong, and in authority.

jbrett
03-22-2006, 02:01 PM
Yeah I did add a time constraint, but I didnt say "I need to get back to my FRIENDS." Its fairly obvious Im there by myself which could be a DLV.
In my head Im have problems conveying value around older girls (28+) even if they are ugly.

Malibu
03-22-2006, 02:24 PM
Yeah I did add a time constraint, but I didnt say "I need to get back to my FRIENDS." Its fairly obvious Im there by myself which could be a DLV.
In my head Im have problems conveying value around older girls (28+) even if they are ugly.
Your problem is calibration...you know what you need to do...add a FTC and root the question as obie said...you know that....you just need to keep practicing the delivery of your material...
I reckon your problem is tone and body language.
KEEP PRACTICING...CALIBRATE AND INTERNALIZE.
good luck
:cool:
Malibu

Scooby
03-22-2006, 04:06 PM
Yeah I did add a time constraint, but I didnt say "I need to get back to my FRIENDS." Its fairly obvious Im there by myself which could be a DLV.
If you are by yourself then you dont need to add this. You can change it to "ive got to get going in a minute / get back to work / meet someone" etc. And its only a DLV if you let it be - dont let it bother you. This is an inner game issue - youre a fun guy remember, a guy who can make friends cause he's a confident socialable guy, right? Why does it matter what they think - it doesnt!

In my head Im have problems conveying value around older girls (28+) even if they are ugly.
Again, inner game issue plus you need more practice. Look at your stories - do they display enough value? Mostly, work on your delivery and confidence - if your delivery and confidence are 100% you can get away with saying almost anything.

Vincent Chase
03-22-2006, 09:42 PM
It's in your approach. I'm willing to bet my left nut, i'm a little attached to the right one, that you are approaching your set diectly and initiating conversation with the target, AND possibly faltering with the three second rule.
We approach indirectly and initiate conversation so as not to invade their personal space AND to give them the impression that we are not talking to them solely for the reasonof talking to them, they just happened to be handy.
If you walk up to somone one directly, hips facing them, making eye contact and all, they are going to know that you are talking to them because you WANT to and that you may have another motive, not because you actually need their opnion. Spproach at an angle if you must go to the setdirectly, otherwise it's best to walk by, maybe stage an argument with a friend, then say "Hey, i'll ask you guys. I need an opinion on something..." You have to remain congruent with actually needing an opinion, if it's obvious that you're trying to pick them up then they will recognize the opener for what it is, stay genuine and congruent.
Next, DO NOT talk to the target first, talk to the obstacle for about 1/3 of the convo, then talk to them both for about 1.5/3 an finallytalk to the target only about .5/3 of the game. These are not actual figures and are very bad approximations, I'm only usuing them to stress that talking to the target is not the main concern, disarming the target is.
Now in a two set you aren't going to be able to isolate but stay true to that, when you hit C1 the orbit can stay but she will mostly be forgotten will most likely disengage from the set all together.
As a personal rule, I do not ask more than two opion openers, I come off as an inquisitor. Stack with non-question openers and throw some actual routines into A1.
It also seems like you didn't give a reason for asking the question, which is entirely what setting up a fake argument is doing, give her a reason so she doesn't feel like it's specifically aimed at her, something like:
"Let me get your opinion, for an article i'm writing..."
"My friend's trying to tell me *such and such* and this guy is so wrong, tell me..."
"Spare me a moment *for my new book*, *i'm writing about relationships* & I need a female opinion."
Giving her a reason makes your approach VALID, you have an actual reason. Using a time constraint is going to be VERY helpful but it's not necessary.
Also, Learn to appropriate your game to each sarge, this is done through a process called "calibration,"
Hope I helped.

Hysteria
03-22-2006, 09:52 PM
Root the opener as previously mentioned. This makes the question sound legitimate and the girls happened to be there when you were wondering about it or having the debate with your friends, even if this is false. You could have asked ANYBODY else, but THEY are conveniently there.
If they keep inquiring why you're asking them, ignore it and stack into a routine to attempt to set the social hook again.