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Cold Lazurus
03-09-2008, 08:24 AM
Mastering sexual framing without coming off as a horny weirdo. This is what I'm trying to accomplish.
What are your feelings on this?
This is where I am right now:
So far this year my game has really improved. I have crushed my AA, and my attraction-building skills are on fire. Every time I go out now I will AT LEAST kiss close, and always get solid numbers which do not flake. In fact, lately I don't even need to time bridge. I will often exhange numbers with a chick, and she will call or text me BEFORE I get a chance to set up a day 2 with them. I almost never get flakes; my day2s always come through. All good so far. But here's the rub: I keep falling into the "potential- boyfriend-dating" category, and that is not what I want. What I want is to F-close consistently on my day2s, and not have to go on a series of dull dates which follow the same old, courtship script which society inflicts on us.
All of my day2s involve kiss closing, but the HBs won't come back to my place. It's always: "I'm not like that"... or "I don't sleep with guys who I'm not in a monogamous relationship with"... or "I'm sleeping in my own bed tonight" and so on. All of which are basically assertions of ASD. But those women always want to keep seeing me anyway, while I just get bored, and don't want to invest the time and money into "dating", when all I want is to get laid.
Which brings me to Sexual Framing. This is obviously where I'm going wrong. I am clearly putting myself in the "potential boyfriend" category. But I'm just not feeling congruent enough in my ability to escalate sexual framing. I just get stuck in comfort-rapport. I think I'm just too worried about coming off as a "horny guy" as well.
Do you guys have any advice on sexual framing? Can you reccomend any good products which could help me?

majesty95
03-09-2008, 01:20 PM
My guess is you're not moving to seduction on Day 2. You've obviously got attraction, you just haven't seduced them. You have to up their buying temperature and find a way to get them back to your place.

djtetsu
03-09-2008, 01:46 PM
I'm no expert, but here goes.

Go into deep conversations and frame things like

Sex is so commercialized, and it's something that's being used to lure me into buying something. Britney Spears and pretty people are on television, but do you (ask the girl) feel like our society is so sterile? To use it to sell things is ok, but it's like they associate some type of shame to the actual thing. We shouldn't have to apologize for the feelings that we get as human beings..

"Society's social expectations limit us so much, and things we're expected to do.. work that 9 to 5, don't do drugs don't do that... and I think everyone needs to be more individual, and find out the things that they really want for themselves. I'm sure there were times when what you wanted didn't agree with what your parents wanted, or what your friends wanted..."

Her own barriers.. "Everyone needs to step out of their comfort zones every once in a while allow themselves to take chances. I don't want to have lived a life that I played it safe all the time. "

Mention that you can be discrete (convey that you won't go bragging about this). An example of this would be to tell a story about how you used to know a group of friends (some girls) and you slept with one of them, but it was you guys' dirty little secret (maybe because she just got out of a relationship or whatever) and you can take that deeper, and say how people found out, gossiped and you hate people that gossip.

If she still needs to hear more go to the spirituality route, and say you're a deeply spiritual guy, and one thing you believe in... is not enlightenment but OPENESS, and how we need to connect with each other more.

A great guy teaching this style is EL TOPO. I think his is a tweaked version of CAPTAIN JACK's

Fey
03-09-2008, 06:06 PM
Try (sexual?) subtexts. I think Cajun wrote something about it which you can find in the classic writings.

...and the HBs need a reason to come back to your place (like watching your cat do backflips and swim in the aquarium or something) other than the potential of making out + having sex with you.

Oh, and make her help set the mood ('pick some cd, I'm gonna light the candles' sorta thing)

just a thought :)

P.S. I know these have nothing to do with social framing. But it will help you not to trigger ASD.

_Cane_
03-10-2008, 08:31 AM
I got through some ASD recently by going caveman style. The girl kept biting her lip and being all wierd so I knew she was down she just needed to be pushed.

I was getting annoyed and then I remembered the pheromone kid interview. So I ran my fingers through her hair and got really close to her face and was like "I'd love to fuck you...". LOL At first I thought she was going to react bad but it helped a lot. After a few more seconds I pulled out my dick and she grabbed it immediately and while stroking it she said "I can't.. someone is going to walk in on us.."... (Excuse).. So I literally said "succck my dick..." and laid on my back and she went to town on me I was like yay finally!

Cold Lazurus
03-10-2008, 09:32 AM
Guys -thanks a lot for the feedback. Much appreciated.
It seems to me that a chick's "buying temperature" is such a fragile thing, and I'm clearly not doing enough to increase it on my day2s. It seems to me there are some very different schools of thought here: from having a sexual subtext to caveman style.
Cheers for the responses.
Back into the trenches i go!

Colin
03-10-2008, 01:53 PM
That's cool that you get that far into your interactions and don't get much flaking so good job.:D


To me it's become more and more evident that when you get good amounts of ASD/LMR you made some mistakes earlier on, so yeah, you should start setting and playing your framework early in the set. Keep in mind also that you have a lot of things going on simultaneously as far communication/sub-communication. Like HOW you use your body language, voice tone, touching(kino) as well as WHAT you're talking about and HOW you're using those things to sub-communicate and help set a sexual vibe.

All this plays a part when you're DHV or telling a story. Whenever you're demonstrating value, in a sense you're setting a frame for yourself that she's either gonna accept or not and this also ties into qualification and grounding. Kinda like what djtetsu was saying, but you wanna ground stuff like that to an experience or something she can relate with so there's a certain amount of (assumed) rapport building.


When your sets go really well, there's gonna be a fluidity and overlap of attraction, qualification, comfort, and seduction. So you wanna tap into many emotions frequently, mix it up. A few sides you wanna tap on are adventurous, spontaneous, independent thinker so if you can mix those into your DHV stuff or stories and ground them or make it as if those are sides of your personality you like to nurture every once in a while. You also wanna get it across that you're discreet and non-judgmental. Some good "routines" are Rings on Fingers and Strawberry Fields.

Seduction is a lot like attraction; Push/pull, teasing and kino escalation qualifying, take aways/state breaks etc. If you play your game right early on LMR should be minimal.

Also some good resources are the various blogs; Sinn, Captain Jack, and El Topo's have tons of stuff archived specifically dealing with this.

Good luck man;)

Cold Lazurus
03-11-2008, 10:52 AM
Colin... Thanks for the feedback.
I'm aware of the "Rings on fingers" and "Strawberry Fields" routines, but I've never used them. I never felt that I could really ground them in the interactions, which again, I suppose, comes back to framing. Also... you say that LMR/ ASD comes from making mistakes early on, however, after reading Captain Jack and Sinn's LRs, they seem to get LMR frequently... but mostly just plow through it. Interesting...