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DSLupus
01-01-2008, 12:48 PM
I was cruising through the Best of forum earlier today and remembered this thread.

http://www.theattractionforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17733

There was an interesting, if tangential discussion on certain hobbies chasing away quality women. Personally, I have to call bullshit. But not for the reason some of you may think.

The argument was that hobbies like D&D, Star Trek, Star Wars, and video games chase off the highest quality women. I say thee nay, that it is obsession and lack of productivity that kills the attraction.

Here's an example.

This is Kevin Smith (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0003620/), the man who made Clerks, Clerks II, Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back, and Dogma. He is also one of the biggest damn nerds on the planet.

This is Jennifer Schwalbach Smith, (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0777059/) former USA Today journalist and Kevin's wife and mother of his daughter. Not a likely match is it?

But what is the main difference between Kevin and all the sci-fi nerds who don't get laid? Kevin took his passion and did something productive with it: he made movies that millions of people love. To paraphrase Style, there's no social proof quite like having fans.

Do you play D&D? How about writing that novel you've been thinking about or putting some of that fantasy art you've put together at a local gallery? Do you like Star Trek? Have you ever considered doing special effects for independent film? You say you read comic books? Ever dreamed of writing one yourself? What's the hold-up?

Peter Jackson may be a fantasy fiction nerd, but he's a nerd whose movie won 11 fucking Oscars!

Now before someone anal retentive gets on my case and says something beta and gratuitous like, "But you're not Peter Jackson," consider this a pre-emptive fuck you. The bar has been set. You can either rise to meet it, you can surpass it, or you can be like every other poor sap out there content to revel in mediocrity or ashamed of what you find interesting.

Here's another example of alpha behaviour. George "Corpsegrinder" Fisher is the lead vocalist of death metal icons Cannibal Corpse. They're the highest charting extreme metal band in history and still going strong. Now check this shit. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CXtyYiI5HDk) Fans watched that, and it just made them love him even more. The fact is, Corpsegrinder is a nerd, but he's also a respected metal vocalist with millions of fans, so in his mind, playing World of Warcraft is nothing to be ashamed of.

However, if you still think your hobbies are too geeky to attract women, how about branching them out into something productive instead of cutting one more fun thing out of your life?

I don't care how hot you think a woman is. I don't care if you think she's a 10. If she tells me that she'll break up with me if I don't stop writing fantasy short stories and playing D&D with my best friends once a week, I'll save her the trouble and kick her ass to the curb. If I give up things I love to appease her, she's going to dump me eventually anyway.

You can have any hobby you want, but in order for your passion to trigger attraction, there are certain things you must do.

First of all, don't foist it on her. If she sees you enjoying yourself and wants to be part of that, she'll come to you.

Second, turn it into something productive. There's enough crossover in different hobbies that you're bound to find something you like. Experiment and start creating things of value to others.

Third, make sure it makes you happy. No mature person will ever fault you for doing something that makes you happy, so long as you're not hurting yourself or others.

If the women you're dating can't deal with these aspects of your life and give you the ultimatum to choose between them and your passions, I sincerely hope you make the right choice.

cleardarknight
01-01-2008, 02:08 PM
great post man. A little long winded tho.

I'm reading it and who came to mind for me was Stevie Cabbalaro - Skateboarding LEGEND and avid toy collector. The point being if Steve was a toy collector or George Fisher was Warcraft player and nothing else they would be loner AFC's, but there not because they have lives outside of their hobbies.
Wanna be a geek and get laid? Be a geek with a life!!

silverghost
01-01-2008, 07:27 PM
I wont go into details here but I ll only say that if u have a strong frame and you have balance in your life u can do whatever you want.

Vulture629
01-01-2008, 09:34 PM
The argument was that hobbies like D&D, Star Trek, Star Wars, and video games chase off the highest quality women. I say thee nay, that it is obsession and lack of productivity that kills the attraction.

Truth, but only kind of.

The sad part is that all of those hobbies aren't just entertainment, but for nearly everyone who does them, they make it the only thing they have.

For example I like Wrestling, Bowling, and Old school RPGs but I don't make them my only hobby. I'll enjoy those things on my own time and not thrust them upon anyone (Bowling is an exception: Going bowling with a female and teaching them basic techniques is a DHV-filled Day 2 IMO)

What I'm trying to say is that those kind of ppl your mentioning (ESPECIALLY D&D nerds) hate everything else that everyone else likes. Just ask one of them. They'll tell you, they'll preach to you more than anyone in church why D&D is better than females and that females hate them cuz they like D&D. Their evidence? "Well I just kind of know." This was from a discussion I had with a D&D nerd who I used to know (26 and never talked to a female other than his mom, sad sad sad).

Being a fan is one thing. Being a fanatic is something else. I hate fanatics who actually believe that their miserable trash works of crap (known to most as fanfiction) is original. Get rid of the fanatics, they friggin poison the planet with their cosplay and fanfiction (and I mean cosplaying in ANY convention).

cheez avenger
01-01-2008, 09:50 PM
There's a time and a place for hobbies. It's when you let your "hobbies" get in the way of you having an active social life that will turn them off.

Kevin Smith may be a scumbag, but he has major game and like you mentioned was already social proofed up the ass. He's a sharp cat, and I only call him a scumbag with the upmost love. :)

I'm a film freak like you would not believe. I may not know what 2+2 is, but can tell you who the editor of "Memento" was, or who was the Cinematographer for "Pan's Labyrinth". My point is that when the boys come over so we can hit the clubs or my lady comes by so we can go out--my love for film takes a backseat until I take care of business.

Cats HAVE TO prioritize.

-cheez avenger

DSLupus
01-01-2008, 10:13 PM
great post man. A little long winded tho.

Wait until I get going.


The sad part is that all of those hobbies aren't just entertainment, but for nearly everyone who does them, they make it the only thing they have.

Granted. The negative stigma based around various activities comes from the worst examples of the practitioners. In plain man-talk, stereotypes gotta come from somewhere.


(Bowling is an exception: Going bowling with a female and teaching them basic techniques is a DHV-filled Day 2 IMO)

(jots down in notebook)


Being a fan is one thing. Being a fanatic is something else. I hate fanatics who actually believe that their miserable trash works of crap (known to most as fanfiction) is original. Get rid of the fanatics, they friggin poison the planet with their cosplay and fanfiction (and I mean cosplaying in ANY convention).

A quick nanosecond of devil's advocate, I've been to a couple of anime conventions (and yes, I'm aware that 99% of the anime shipped overseas is poppy, mainstream, even throw-away crap, but damn it I cannot stop loving Cowboy Bebop) that had some extremely fine women in costume. Sadly, this was before I knew of the community and was somewhere between useless and utterly fucking useless with women at the time. The last two times I went, I saw a chick dressed as Ivy from Soul Caliber (I spent most of my time in the registration line staring at her ass), and three girls including a stunning Phillipina dressed as the girls from Final Fantasy X. In my AFCness, my main mantra on that day was, "Don't... get... hard..."

So yeah, for the most part I hear you and I do agree with you. But on the occassions when it involves a legitimately hot woman in a skimpy costume I ain't gonna complain.

Vulture629
01-01-2008, 11:31 PM
(jots down in notebook)

ONLY if you know what you're doing. I bowl in a league that has the same conditions all the pros have, so I know a thing or five about bowling. So if your good at bowling and know why your good, then you can coach her during the date.

True Pimp
01-02-2008, 01:21 AM
If she tells me that she'll break up with me if I don't stop writing fantasy short stories and playing D&D with my best friends once a week, I'll save her the trouble and kick her ass to the curb. If I give up things I love to appease her, she's going to dump me eventually anyway.

So very true! This is like...relationships summed up in one short sentence! :)

Oh, and I couldn't decide which Cannibal Corpse video I liked more,

"I Cum Blood"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nFnIJZyBhi0&NR

or "Hammer Smashed Face" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTpQOZcNASw

:confused:

DSLupus
01-02-2008, 01:31 AM
ONLY if you know what you're doing.

Give me some credit. ;)


So very true! This is like...relationships summed up in one short sentence! :)

Sort of. Men and women both forget that relationships are two-way streets and each person is allowed to have a life outside of the other.


Oh, and I couldn't decide which Cannibal Corpse video I liked more,

"I Cum Blood"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nFnIJZyBhi0&NR

or "Hammer Smashed Face" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTpQOZcNASw

:confused:

Webster rules.

Colin
01-02-2008, 01:49 AM
I like what Silverghost said.

I'm a huge "geek". Astroboy, Mazinger Z,Anime, Star Wars, Original toys(18" Alien, 12"Bobba Fett), comics, video games, all sorts of shit. If you saw me though you probably wouldn't guess it.

Those things are "hobbies" for me. I don't have a career in any of it, but that doesn't mean I don't have an appreciation for it. But I don't roll up wearing Han Solo gear to camp out for the movies, I have my limits.

"Geeky" shit can be endearing for girls but that doesn't mean you should abandon any of the M3 model. Most girls don't find that stuff "attractive" but once they are into you based on your other awsome qualities they don't really care, it's just another part of you.

P.S. I've been to many a comic convention and there's a reason why even "The Simpsons" have a character based on the stereotype. You see that guy there with the faint stench of jerk-off and Doritos. I don't care how you "frame" it, he's probably not getting any.

silverghost
01-02-2008, 03:14 AM
Since this is becoming a huge and quite honestly a nice thread since we get to know each other more than just picking up women practisioners (my spelling sucks shoot me), I ll tell you some stuff about me to explain why if u have a strong frame u can do whatever u want.
I go to the gym since 14, i aint muscled up but i am toned. I learn martial arts since 14. I used to work as bodyguard and now I use the people i met from that job for Public Relations. I like to dress well and when I walk on a room girls notice me even though I am average looking. My social life couldnt be better and I have no problem meeting women.
Now would you expect a guy like that to play warcraft, D&D, or reading books? Maybe u ll never expect that he likes art and can watch tons of movies and anime. I can go on but u got my point.
Thing is that you dont open a set with hi i am silver and i like warcraft. When you ll be discussing about hobbies you ll already have created a nice frame for yourself, attraction, comfort and hell u ll learn some embaressing things about her first:p . Now if u say I only play WoW u ll have problems. If u make it a part of your interesting life and make sure that u dont stay home playing 24/7 u can pretty much tell anything u want.
I wont stop repeating that the key to live a successful life is to have a balanced life. And ofcourse The Game is just a part of it, as with all your other hobbies.

P.S. There are some stuff you might wanna hide:p for example if u are into S&M u cant tell that before u research the girl;p . If you like porn she ll know at some laaaaater point. Everything has its place and the right time to say em or show em lol

The_Jedi
01-02-2008, 05:04 AM
What about porn conventions? Lots of ladies there, too, believe it or not. ;)

Cire
01-02-2008, 11:14 AM
I was in Vegas this weekend, and they had some ads for the AVNs which are next weekend, and mannnn, that would be a dream setup for a good PUA.

On the thread topic, I used to play starcraft at least 5 hours a day when I was a freshman in high school. The rest of my time was spent watching anime, reading star was books, and collecting action figures. I enjoyed it, but I also didn't kiss a girl until my senior year (by which point I had lost 45 lbs and started running track instead).

The big question I had to ask myself is what I had to give up to enjoy my hobby. And I don't mean because of what other people think of you, I mean because we enjoy our hobbies in our free time, and for most people, this is limited. I'm a full time student and work part time, so I don't have much free time. My hobby became running, so I didn't have as much time for starcraft. And I think it was a wise decision, because I looked better and felt better because of it.

Life needs balance, and our breaths are limited. Being a PUA is building a better lifestyle and learning to make the most of every breath.

I still read a lot, but instead I read authors like Ed Abbey, Emerson, and Steinbeck. I play poker and go bowling once a week. I hike at least 2 or 3 times a week. I go running and lift weights every other night. I snowboard and wakeboard, and really enjoy both. I spend hours each week working on my car. I go paintballing, or play sports with friends.

I still watch cowboy bebop though, (I have all 26 eps and the movie on dvd) just because spike kicks so much ass. I still play warcraft sometimes, though I have to admit that I have a few very attractive female friends who play more Warcraft than I do. And you know why they play? Because they have friends or boyfriends that are interested in it, and they ended up enjoying it, and now they have a common interest they can share together.

If you are an interesting person, people will find what you do interesting. I'm sure if they were that guy that smells like doritos, and talks l33t all the time, then they wouldn't have found the game so interesting. Women like passionate men, so make sure that you are passionate about the things in your life (and her too) and you won't go wrong.

CAFFEINE
01-02-2008, 12:30 PM
Woah,

Another eye opener. I thank God for this community of excellent people. I have to say that for the last 3-4 years of my life, since I first discovered this community through David D, I neglected some of the things I used to love most, which were video games and anime. I got away from them drastically, I still play video games but I totally dissociated myself from anime, which I started to look at with contempt. But as it was so very well said in an above post, it is not the hobby that chases women away, it is the obsession and the gravity pull that a person gives that hobby. When I had my first job, the first thing I bought with my first paycheck was a PS2. Then a XBox. Then A dreamcast. Then a Gamecube. Whenever I wasn't working I was playing videogames, the breaks in between were watching anime I downloaded from the internet or posting something in a message board about anime. Pretty motherfucking pathetic. I was 18-19 years old then. I stumbled upon DD's stuff some time between 20-21. I went to the other extreme, which was to quit those hobbies altogether, but the other mistake I made, was to fail to acquire new hobbies. So although I had the satisfaction of destroying the geek I had become, I became a boring asshole with no passions in life.

Right now I practice Tae Kwon Do and body build. With the current job I have and where I'm at right now (the land of the Taliban) I have very little spare time, which I spend religiously on those two things, online college and reading all sorts of self-growth/ financial books. I yet have to find something I'm truly passionate for, I don't see martial arts and body building so much as hobbies but rather as necessary skills/ characteristics a real man must possess.

Domeremy
01-03-2008, 01:24 AM
I wont go into details here but I ll only say that if u have a strong frame and you have balance in your life u can do whatever you want.
Thats true almost always but stuff like d&d or wow are DLVs, plain and simple. You can have a strong frame and overcome the DLV but why bother when its easier to avoid the DLV by not admitting you like nerdy things.

DSLupus
01-03-2008, 02:27 AM
Thats true almost always but stuff like d&d or wow are DLVs, plain and simple. You can have a strong frame and overcome the DLV but why bother when its easier to avoid the DLV by not admitting you like nerdy things.

So we should be ashamed of what we like? That's beta thinking, and the attitude I'm attempting to change.

A hobby doesn't dominate your life, it enriches it. I play video games and RPGs, but they don't define who I am. I have enough going for me that if a woman ignores all my good qualities and just complains about the fact that once a week I hang out with my friends to play D&D, why would I want her in my life in the first place?

Cire
01-03-2008, 02:42 AM
Thats true almost always but stuff like d&d or wow are DLVs, plain and simple. You can have a strong frame and overcome the DLV but why bother when its easier to avoid the DLV by not admitting you like nerdy things.

WoW is not a dlv if you present a strong frame. Like I said, I know at least 2 girls who are 8s that play WoW quite a lot, and one of them because her bf got her into it. It's not necessarily a dhv, but its not something to be ashamed of. d&d I can't speak of, cause I've never played it or know anyone who does, but I'm assuming its not too different.

Just as long as a hobby doesn't consume your time to your own detriment, then its fine.

For example, ask yourself what else you could be doing when you're playing d&d. If you were sarging the last two nights before, and maybe worked out earlier that day or got some exercise, then why not kick back and have fun with friends? For me its poker or bowling... for some guys its something else.

Cire
01-03-2008, 02:50 AM
After reading what I just posted, I think we basically said the same thing in different ways. Like with bowling, its not a dhv story if your talking about how you bowled a 300 in league last week (unless the girl is realllllly into bowling...),
but it is a dhv if you talked about how you and some of your bowling friends taught some girls you met at the bowling alley last week how to bowl, and one of them accidentally threw the ball, and it landed on your friend's foot! The problem with wow and dnd and things of that nature, is that unlike bowling, you can't create interesting stories from it.

Most girls would agree that a guy that knows how to work on cars is a dhv. But try telling a girl a 5-minute story about how you tore apart the head on your car and see just how interested she is... The problem is the girl can't relate, and she just gets bored.

Finally, playing dnd or wow isnt nerdy. You have to have that mindset. You play it. You're a cool guy who gets lots of girls. You're NOT nerdy, so how can it be nerdy if you play it?

silverghost
01-03-2008, 04:04 AM
Its DVL if you say I play DnD and WoW for 23 hours a day. Main problem here is that many guys do that so its hard to make it sound like u dont do that. Also dont put hobbies in a narrow frame of doing em because they are DHVs. Even if u tell a girl that u scored a 300 on bowling if she has never played or her bf that was dumping her to play bowling with his friends, it wont make a DHV story.
Also I do know many girls on wow and some of em are 8+ but if u ask em every girl will say that "My ex bf introduced me to it" Meaning that her bf spend a lot of hours in wow (or maybe her) and the attraction left because of jealousy matters (she meets new people in there), (routine), different goals in game, and many more.
Personally I dont like dragging gfs in my own environment or hobbies, because if i break up i ll have em on my face all the time. And worse thing is that i ll have em on my face while i have another girl with me and then hell will get loose.
As I said u can have whatever hobby you like as long as you understand that its a part of your life. Its not a good idea always to merge parts of your life because you dont know the side effects or the after effects. Be who you are and let her be also who she was.

Domeremy
01-05-2008, 12:51 AM
I don't know where some of you guys got the idea thats your superman. IDC how strong your frame is, you cant always change someones mind. The simple truth is certian activities will be considered nerdy or geeky by a LOT of people. You can go ahead and try to reframe it or explain it to them, but if in their mind D&Ds is nerdy, your really wasting your breath.

Its not beta behavior to ignore talking about those hobbies. It's actually a lack of calibration to bring them up, knowing your just DLVing yourself.

Colin
01-05-2008, 02:40 AM
I don't know where some of you guys got the idea thats your superman. IDC how strong your frame is, you cant always change someones mind. The simple truth is certian activities will be considered nerdy or geeky by a LOT of people. You can go ahead and try to reframe it or explain it to them, but if in their mind D&Ds is nerdy, your really wasting your breath.

Its not beta behavior to ignore talking about those hobbies. It's actually a lack of calibration to bring them up, knowing your just DLVing yourself.


Really man, Girls don't care that much (after they're already into you of course). But if you live like a hermit or go to the movies with Frodo gear on then that's a little weird. But honestly girls aren't into a lot of shit guys are anyway, maybe some things because they're more socially acceptable. But if you know how to socially function outside of your hobbies then it's not gonna be a make or break factor.


I don't know how many (prissy) girls I've been with that actually went and downloaded Motorhead or Johnny Cash after they heard me mention I liked stuff like that. Were they really into it...who knows, who cares?

Vulture629
01-05-2008, 02:49 AM
Its not beta behavior to ignore talking about those hobbies. It's actually a lack of calibration to bring them up, knowing your just DLVing yourself.
That all depends on who your saying that to.

For example I don't say to a female right off that I like Oldschool video games, Bowling and Wrestling. I let her find out. Introducing a female to new parts of culture she may have not known about is a DHV if presented right. For my day 2s I go bowling and teach her stuff. Not only does she feel better about herself cuz now shes bowling better but she also thinks better of me cuz I taught her the basics of bowling.

The simple truth is certian activities will be considered nerdy or geeky by a LOT of people.

TRUTH. I challenge any D&D numbnut to go tell a female that you like D&D she'll probably laugh in your face until she pees her pants then get mad at you for making her pee her pants and not only will you feel bad you will feel like a tool. I have NO sympathy for D&D or Trekkie assholes, they hate everyone outside of their culture. At least TRUE anime otaku (those who DON'T cosplay) have something. Not a lot, but something at least. A lot of the anime lovers I know don't just limit what they like...however I am getting sick of all the Naruto and Evangelion fanfiction. I just hate fanfiction in general.

Long-ass story alert. But its a good one.

For example my best bud is an anime freak. He's a decent looking guy, has lots of AA but very pleasant to be around. He says he wants to meet new ppl but just too lazy to do it and doesn't care for venues like bars/nightclubs, he would rather meet ppl during most day game locations. He's only had one girlfriend and he went completely AFC on her, wasting all kinds of $$$ on her, but they spent nearly the whole day together. She cheated on him but whatever. Then she begged and pleaded that they get back together. She even STALKED him. Ha. But my best bud moved forward when any other numbnut would have went RIGHT back.

Theres this kid I know who is HARDCORE D&D. He even writes POEMS about D&D. All kinds of D&D books are in his room, and his whole apartment is littered in D&D character sheets. He's never had a girlfriend...never even kissed a single female, nothing. But one chick who his brother hooked him up with decided to take a chance and by god...this kid got unhealthy amounts of one-itis. So all of us are together and D&D kid, for hours and hours sings the praises of this chick like shes some kind of goddess, does a standup poem for her ON THE SPOT. I leave, cuz I hate poetry with a passion, and its even worse when a D&D redneck is doing it about a female that he only went out with once. After the poem D&D kid gets a drink and the chick sneaks out and drags me with her, and asks me to drive her home (apparently someone took her to the get together). What she was saying was like the "eye opener" for me, an invitation to go back to my cocky funny ways...this female was a 7-8ish btw...slightly better than average looking college student.

Me: How come you want to leave so bad
Her: He was creeping me out
Me: Ugh I thought females like the kind of stuff he does
Her: No way, the stuff he is into is, well, I can't relate to it at all. Anime and stuff I can understand kind of, but not D&D.
Me: Ha, guys still a virgin too! I even told him he's gonna have to change if he wants to meet females.
Her: Your not a virgin too are you?
Me: (note that I wasn't cocky funny at the time) Well I got a BJ once but never banged anyone
Her: I know someone who will bang you. I can hook you up if you want
Me: No can do, gotta be up early tomorrow (which sucked cuz it was true, had to go back up to school the next day)...
Her: Well whatever

so I drop her off and blah. Fast forward to when I see the D&D kid again, and he says that he can't believe that chick did what she did, and that she "broke up" with him via text message. Thats when he says that females will never understand him cuz he likes D&D and Star trek and stuff (ya hes a white boy from the south, who likes D&D, Star trek and poetry, ugh).

But my anime loving best bud still thinks he has something to offer females (he just doesn't care about meeting them at all) and just does not trust them anymore (I guess thats what happens when females cheat on you I guess). But at least he knows he has some semblence of value, where the D&D guy is just plain bad.

Hope you enjoyed the long story of death...

DSLupus
01-05-2008, 04:36 AM
Its not beta behavior to ignore talking about those hobbies. It's actually a lack of calibration to bring them up, knowing your just DLVing yourself.

It's beta behaviour to be ashamed of your hobbies.

Re-read everything I've said because obviously the point isn't sinking in yet.


I don't know how many (prissy) girls I've been with that actually went and downloaded Motorhead or Johnny Cash after they heard me mention I liked stuff like that. Were they really into it...who knows, who cares?

It kills me how many times you hear stories like this and people still don't believe them.


TRUTH. I challenge any D&D numbnut to go tell a female that you like D&D she'll probably laugh in your face until she pees her pants then get mad at you for making her pee her pants and not only will you feel bad you will feel like a tool. I have NO sympathy for D&D or Trekkie assholes, they hate everyone outside of their culture.

Well, it's as you said earlier. Doesn't matter how socially acceptable your hobbies are, if you shove them down people's throats or act like they are your life, they'll resent you.

As an example, I've been involved in greyhound rescue for 13 years this April. I work closely with Steel City Greyhounds to find as many retired racers as possible a good home as opposed to seeing them all put to sleep. My family and I have fostered over 2 dozen dogs, 2 of which of we ended up adopting ourselves. We've owned 5 greyhounds over the course of these 13 years and donated a lot of money and time to the cause.

DHV, right? Not if I awkwardly steer a conversation to the subject when I first meet a girl. Then it sounds like I'm one of those crazy animal hoarders or just trying to impress her. Neither one is terribly appealing.

silverghost
01-05-2008, 06:42 AM
I like the whole arguing over the internet hehe. Especially when some people here actually field tested what they are talking about (I personally never post advice in something I havent field tested or if i do i mention that i have no expirience on it) and trying to make a point and some people just dont wanna hear em.
Anyway if you read my previous post you ll see what I like to do and what my hobbies are. I wont go analysing my hobbies in the first 20 minutes but i will do at some point. Till then I tend to have a strong frame over myself that I must say something really stupid to start cracking it up.
Finding one or two examples of people with no balance in their lives isnt something that we are interested in. You can gather expensive super cars (dont tell me you are a geek if u do?) and have all the money of the world but u have 0 social intuition and girls dont dig you. Wow big news.
DOnt focus on negative advice. Focus on field testing people's advices. In the end girls have all kind of stupid hobbies but no man ever mentions em that they are stupid. They do tell you though and if u are smart you ll be like "if thats important to you I respect it" Not start busting on her about it.
Personally all my gfs knew my hobbies and never had a problem with any of them. I aint the kind of guy that I make my life go around women. If they dont like something i like to hell with em. Some girl might not like your friends or your parents or your taste of music or your job. What you gonna do are you gonna change em? If you work as a person that keeps the town clean you should be ashamed of yourself? Hell no. Especially on that subject (and Style addressed it on his videos) I have a friend that does that job and you wont imagine how successful he is with women. Why? Because he is Alpha.
As i like to say: A lot of beautiful women out there, but only a small number of men that gets it. Do the math.

Domeremy
01-05-2008, 02:21 PM
It's beta behaviour to be ashamed of your hobbies.

Re-read everything I've said because obviously the point isn't sinking in yet.

How about the next time I talk to the cops, I tell them how I have done illiegal things? Oh wait that would be dumb ass hell since I don't want to go to jail. It'd be dumb to tell the cops certain things that incrimate myself and its dumb to tell girls stuff that makes me look nerdy. Life isnt as simple as alpha v beta (or omega).

P.S. Colin made a great point, girls really arent into that kind of shit to begin with.

silverghost
01-05-2008, 03:24 PM
Ok then I guess the bottom line is that I do tell em my hobbies at a time and I still get laid.
Hi my name is Clark Kent.


How about the next time I talk to the cops, I tell them how I have done illiegal things?

Lemmy tell you one story. A cousin of mine had some ex of hers being drunk outside the house telling her that he loves her and some minutes after that he ll kill her. She called me crying to go help her. (I love like 2 blocks away) I tried to calm the dude down but he was piss drunk. So he tried to hit me with a bottle for butting in. I broke his ass off and threw him out.
If i do say that to the police probably i will go to jail even if i was in self defense because I do martial arts and my fists are considered weapons so i cant go out hitting whoever. BUT I ve lived my whole life protecting the people i care about. Although it does convey Alpha I wouldnt go telling the cops about it. So...Remind me your point again?


P.S. Colin made a great point, girls really arent into that kind of shit to begin with.

So because aint into stuff like that everyone should stop em? I aint into men but if she finds it sexy shall i do it? Hell no. Women are part of your life. Hobbies another part of your life. It doesnt mean they shouldnt interract at the minimum as you telling her about em. Trust me if u tell her i do martial arts, i go to the gym, I do surfing,I dance and I play DnD with friend from time to time if she tells you something about it mate seriously start dating normal girls because no woman I met ever had problems with it.

HenryHotspur
01-05-2008, 03:58 PM
You seriously want to use Kevin Smith as your counterexample?

Kevin Smith, millionaire, celebrity, friend with celebrities like Ben Affleck, Matt Damon, etc?

You really think that's comparable? Kevin Smith was directing his 4th feature film around the time they got married.

Here's a good question to ask yourself before you start talking about a hobby:

"Would anybody choose this hobby over hanging out with a cute girl?"

The problem isn't - say - D&D itself. It's that the vast majority of D&D players would gladly quit D&D (and, in fact, do quit D&D) the moment other social options become available to them. So by saying that this is a major hobby, the subtext is "I don't know any girls. I hang out with geeky guys all the time."

Now, this may not be true in your case, but this is the perception. Just like bad clothes, clumsy social skills, or any number of other things - they can all be overcome, but that doesn't mean they don't hurt you. There are plenty of guys who are poor dressers who are great guys - but being a good dresser makes it easier for you.

Don't confuse the following two statements:

"(Hobby X) hurts you."
"(Hobby X) can not be overcome."

There are plenty of hobbies which hurt you - but the nice thing about a hobby is that YOU are in control of how and when you bring it up. If D&D hurts, then don't talk about it. You don't need to hide it, but make sure you've got other things going for you that you can talk about, first!

You're right - 100% - that you can DLV yourself by being defensive about who you are. But you also DLV yourself by associating yourself with things she finds uninteresting, geeky, or boring.

A big part of what this community teaches is how to talk interestingly about what you do, or to acquire skills that she will find interesting. Yes, confidence in who you are is key.

Yes, many handicaps can be overcome.

But if the most interesting thing you have to talk about is D&D (and I say this as a fairly strong chessplayer, and let's be honest, it's no better!) then develop yourself so you have more exciting things to talk about. Down the road she won't care, but right up top?

You'll do better if you're more interesting than that.

silverghost
01-05-2008, 04:25 PM
Personally I d choose to have a balanced life. With my hobbies and my girls. Say I date this girl. And after 2 months I go on some friend to play D&D and she asks me what I ll do what would I say? We go for coffee? We go for drinks? We go to his house? Ok I say those. Say now she is like can I come? What you ll do you ll tell more lies? When I state my hobbies I state that I ll also need time off her at some point to work on my hobbies.
Come on guys attraction doesnt turn off when you do 1 thing right. You aint her knight in the shining armor to be as she wants you. If you use that hobby on your first interraction yes its a turn off. If you say it as part of my other hobbies on 3rd-4th date and/or after we had some amazing sex TRUST me on this, she wont friggin care. What she d care is if you keep mention it all the friggin time. Even if you have 32 super cars worth billions of dollars if thats what u keep talking about she ll grow bored.
Bottom line is have you been your best self? Have you mentioned your hobbies in the way i told you to? Do you avoid mentioning all the time? If yes then you wont have a problem.
Women dont find football interesting shall all the guys that watch football stop watching it because the girls dont like it? Girls arent interested in martial arts also, shall we stop doing em?
Anyway if you think that you dont wanna talk about it dont talk about it. I say that I always mention it and never had a problem about it. Field test it and come here and say you know what I was right. Field testing it isnt though "I heard from this friend of mine thats super geek that he told a woman that he plays and she laughted her ass off" Field test it yourself and do it properly as i told you.

Colin
01-05-2008, 04:46 PM
Shit man we're a bunch of geeks, debating on geekiness*LOL*

Really the same can be said about whatever other shit guys are into. Girls can trip if you're a big sports nut to. Some guys go overboard with the "Fantasy League" shit or develop some odd social patterns whenever their sport is in season. Guys do a bunch of stuff that women don't understand.

Motorsports, fishing/hunting, fixing shit, horror/sci-fi movies, loud music, guns, fighting, video games, porn, whatever. And we also may have magazines laying around about this shit. Girls aren't into this shit (there are exceptions of course).

If you're a weirdo, like the guy in Vultures story, then you're gonna have some problems. The thing is that guy had a shot with that girl. He may not have stood a chance but she at least put her self out there.

TrueStory
01-05-2008, 05:10 PM
I was cruising through the Best of forum earlier today and remembered this thread.

http://www.theattractionforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17733

There was an interesting, if tangential discussion on certain hobbies chasing away quality women. Personally, I have to call bullshit. But not for the reason some of you may think.

The argument was that hobbies like D&D, Star Trek, Star Wars, and video games chase off the highest quality women. I say thee nay, that it is obsession and lack of productivity that kills the attraction.

Here's an example.

This is Kevin Smith (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0003620/), the man who made Clerks, Clerks II, Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back, and Dogma. He is also one of the biggest damn nerds on the planet.

This is Jennifer Schwalbach Smith, (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0777059/) former USA Today journalist and Kevin's wife and mother of his daughter. Not a likely match is it?


http://www.theattractionforums.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=1638&stc=1&d=1199581746





Kevin Smith has HELL OF A SOCIAL PROOF, hence confidence.


Average game playing nerd, doesn't.

He didn't get laid until he became famous.

Nuff said.

DjSuperman717
01-05-2008, 05:31 PM
I was cruising through the Best of forum earlier today and remembered this thread.

http://www.theattractionforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17733

There was an interesting, if tangential discussion on certain hobbies chasing away quality women. Personally, I have to call bullshit. But not for the reason some of you may think.

The argument was that hobbies like D&D, Star Trek, Star Wars, and video games chase off the highest quality women. I say thee nay, that it is obsession and lack of productivity that kills the attraction.

Here's an example.

This is Kevin Smith (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0003620/), the man who made Clerks, Clerks II, Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back, and Dogma. He is also one of the biggest damn nerds on the planet.

This is Jennifer Schwalbach Smith, (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0777059/) former USA Today journalist and Kevin's wife and mother of his daughter. Not a likely match is it?

But what is the main difference between Kevin and all the sci-fi nerds who don't get laid? Kevin took his passion and did something productive with it: he made movies that millions of people love. To paraphrase Style, there's no social proof quite like having fans.

Do you play D&D? How about writing that novel you've been thinking about or putting some of that fantasy art you've put together at a local gallery? Do you like Star Trek? Have you ever considered doing special effects for independent film? You say you read comic books? Ever dreamed of writing one yourself? What's the hold-up?

Peter Jackson may be a fantasy fiction nerd, but he's a nerd whose movie won 11 fucking Oscars!

Now before someone anal retentive gets on my case and says something beta and gratuitous like, "But you're not Peter Jackson," consider this a pre-emptive fuck you. The bar has been set. You can either rise to meet it, you can surpass it, or you can be like every other poor sap out there content to revel in mediocrity or ashamed of what you find interesting.

Here's another example of alpha behaviour. George "Corpsegrinder" Fisher is the lead vocalist of death metal icons Cannibal Corpse. They're the highest charting extreme metal band in history and still going strong. Now check this shit. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CXtyYiI5HDk) Fans watched that, and it just made them love him even more. The fact is, Corpsegrinder is a nerd, but he's also a respected metal vocalist with millions of fans, so in his mind, playing World of Warcraft is nothing to be ashamed of.

However, if you still think your hobbies are too geeky to attract women, how about branching them out into something productive instead of cutting one more fun thing out of your life?

I don't care how hot you think a woman is. I don't care if you think she's a 10. If she tells me that she'll break up with me if I don't stop writing fantasy short stories and playing D&D with my best friends once a week, I'll save her the trouble and kick her ass to the curb. If I give up things I love to appease her, she's going to dump me eventually anyway.

You can have any hobby you want, but in order for your passion to trigger attraction, there are certain things you must do.

First of all, don't foist it on her. If she sees you enjoying yourself and wants to be part of that, she'll come to you.

Second, turn it into something productive. There's enough crossover in different hobbies that you're bound to find something you like. Experiment and start creating things of value to others.

Third, make sure it makes you happy. No mature person will ever fault you for doing something that makes you happy, so long as you're not hurting yourself or others.

If the women you're dating can't deal with these aspects of your life and give you the ultimatum to choose between them and your passions, I sincerely hope you make the right choice.


there are some things that makes women think that you are weird tho;
like talking about ufo's or conspiracy theories to a large group;
everyone will always call you crazy or psycho;
every single time;
test it out if you dont belive me;
but maybe once in a blue moon (rarely) you will find another person who are into the same dorky stuff

silverghost
01-05-2008, 06:35 PM
Actually conspiracy theories along with religion and politics are some of the taboos that you shouldnt discuss with women. I think there are more but cant remember. Thx for bringing it up DjSuperman717 I had it on my notes to say it lol.
As for what Colin said... we are on a forum discussing about women, ofcourse we are geeks. Adorable though:p till the masks come off when we go out at nights haha.

Colin
01-05-2008, 08:29 PM
[QUOTE=silverghost;
As for what Colin said... we are on a forum discussing about women, ofcourse we are geeks. Adorable though:p till the masks come off when we go out at nights haha.[/QUOTE]


WORD!!!

DSLupus
01-06-2008, 01:13 AM
How about the next time I talk to the cops, I tell them how I have done illiegal things? Oh wait that would be dumb ass hell since I don't want to go to jail. It'd be dumb to tell the cops certain things that incrimate myself and its dumb to tell girls stuff that makes me look nerdy. Life isnt as simple as alpha v beta (or omega).

Dude, you're not listening to me.

Don't shove your hobbies, no matter what they are, down people's throats. Let them find out for themselves.


P.S. Colin made a great point, girls really arent into that kind of shit to begin with.

I've known several very attractive women who are into video games, RPGs, comics, and anime. You're buying into the stereotypes even more than you think women do.


You seriously want to use Kevin Smith as your counterexample?

Kevin Smith, millionaire, celebrity, friend with celebrities like Ben Affleck, Matt Damon, etc?

You really think that's comparable? Kevin Smith was directing his 4th feature film around the time they got married.

Do you actually think a woman like that didn't have a whole shitload of other options? We're not talking about Anna Nicole Smith here.


There are plenty of hobbies which hurt you - but the nice thing about a hobby is that YOU are in control of how and when you bring it up.

That's a point Colin already addressed. Don't ram it down somebody's throat, no matter how great you may think it is.


But if the most interesting thing you have to talk about is D&D (and I say this as a fairly strong chessplayer, and let's be honest, it's no better!) then develop yourself so you have more exciting things to talk about. Down the road she won't care, but right up top?

You'll do better if you're more interesting than that.

What did I say that gave you the impression that I don't do anything else? What gave you the impression that I'm that socially retarded?


Come on guys attraction doesnt turn off when you do 1 thing right. You aint her knight in the shining armor to be as she wants you. If you use that hobby on your first interraction yes its a turn off. If you say it as part of my other hobbies on 3rd-4th date and/or after we had some amazing sex TRUST me on this, she wont friggin care. What she d care is if you keep mention it all the friggin time. Even if you have 32 super cars worth billions of dollars if thats what u keep talking about she ll grow bored.

This is exactly what I'm talking about. Thank you!


Kevin Smith has HELL OF A SOCIAL PROOF, hence confidence.

Average game playing nerd, doesn't.

He didn't get laid until he became famous.

Nuff said.

You also don't get it. I said this myself. He's not ashamed of his geeky pursuits because of how much else he has going for him.

Star Wars doesn't get you laid, but neither does my greyhound rescue work. Does that mean I should cut both out of my life?


As for what Colin said... we are on a forum discussing about women, ofcourse we are geeks. Adorable though:p till the masks come off when we go out at nights haha.

Seems there are a few closet cases though.

Domeremy
01-06-2008, 01:43 AM
Dude, you're not listening to me.
Dude your not listening to me. You said you should never be ashamed of hobbies. I said its not all about being emberessed but about being smart and knowing what to say and what not to say.


I've known several very attractive women who are into video games, RPGs, comics, and anime. You're buying into the stereotypes even more than you think women do.
I already know some girls do like nerdy shit. But most don't. Sterotypes are just like the "rules" we learn about attraction. Nothing is written in stone; their is always an exception. But its easier to follow the rule and not the exception... So its better not to bring up nerdy stuff since odds are most girls wont like it.


What gave you the impression that I'm that socially retarded?
A lot of things;)

DSLupus
01-06-2008, 01:49 AM
Dude your not listening to me. You said you should never be ashamed of hobbies. I said its not all about being emberessed but about being smart and knowing what to say and what not to say.

Then why the incredibly ridiculous analogy with the cops?


I already know some girls do like nerdy shit. But most don't. Sterotypes are just like the "rules" we learn about attraction. Nothing is written in stone; their is always an exception. But its easier to follow the rule and not the exception... So its better not to bring up nerdy stuff since odds are most girls wont like it.

That doesn't mean that the stereotype should define your overall behaviour and lifestyle. There are guys around here who completely cut things they enjoy from their lives because there are negative stereotypes about it. I ask you, does that make sense?

Saying you're going to sell your X-Box and DVD copies of Lord of the Rings because there are women out there who roll their eyes at that sort of thing is about as stupid as letting said X-Box dominate your life. That's the whole point I'm trying to get at.

Colin
01-06-2008, 01:57 AM
LOLOLOLOL!!! I love this Shit!

Don't forget girls have "sex parties" where they have all sorts of sex toys and devices on display for them to indulge...and purchase.

Someone else pointed out in this thread that girls are into just as much goofy ass shit as guys are.

You'd be suprised as to how endearing I was after I mentioned I still have my old "Star Wars" figures or "Fantastic 4" comics.

I will admit though that way way way back, I had a LTR that griped about me having "Misfits" and horror movie posters on my wall...at my parents house. Her "real" gripe wasn't about that, but rather about me being a "freak" about it, and not paying attention to where I was going in life in general.

Like was said before, you can be into this stuff, but there's no need to shove it in her face or make it like you're a crazy fanboy.

Domeremy
01-06-2008, 02:00 AM
Then why the incredibly ridiculous analogy with the cops?
You made it seem like your life should be an open book and you can talk about anything to anyone. My point is you cant tell the cops certain things and you cant tell girls certain things.


That doesn't mean that the stereotype should define your overall behaviour and lifestyle. There are guys around here who completely cut things they enjoy from their lives because there are negative stereotypes about it. I ask you, does that make sense?
Maybe its just me but i find certain hobbies are NEVER associated with cool people.

Saying you're going to sell your X-Box and DVD copies of Lord of the Rings because there are women out there who roll their eyes at that sort of thing is about as stupid as letting said X-Box dominate your life. That's the whole point I'm trying to get at.
Depending on what the hobby is, you really might need to quit it if its considered really nerdy.

sdnightfly
01-06-2008, 02:02 AM
It's not the hobby, it's about how much you talk about that hobby to the point of sounding like a know it all, that she's ripping her hair out. Using jargon doesn't help, so if there are people around using jargon, even if it's not my girlfriend, I'll rephrase it to where they get it.

There are tons of hobbies guys are into ranging from restoring cars to sports, to music, and the amount of interest she has in it. Maybe you're investing more money into it than you should, and she's getting pissed that you'd spend hundreds of dollars on something rare, but not a night out. If it's a consuming interest of yours, she doesn't want to be a distant second to it.

Some hobbies are obsessions, and that's where the DLVing happens.

As far as UFOs go, if you can make it interesting to her, she'll get something out of it. Close her out of it, then it's not a good outcome.

But if it's something you enjoy and she's making you decide her or the hobby should go...she should go because she's planning into turning you into what she wants, which time and time again causes relationships to end. But if she's willing to let you continue to enjoy the hobby, but the compromise would be less time spent on the hobby, why not...

Aaron AO
01-06-2008, 02:07 AM
i keep all my lame hobbies secret from EVERYONE.

i used to watch anime in high school and play on the football and rugby team. i woulda got shit ripped outta me haha.

Pony Boy
01-06-2008, 02:10 AM
Some hobbies are obsessions, and that's where the DLVing happens.
yep, pretty much...i participate in "cool" hobbies...and sometimes my dedication to them gets the best of me when i start talking about them. now, i don't talk about them at all....i just mention that i do them. if they want to learn more, i invite them to one of my events instead of breaking down every little detail about the culture.

also, i'm not a car guy...but when some of my friends start telling me about their GZ450 TURBO XL with stickshift duel transmission drifting tire whatevers....i just wanna shoot myself. its a big DLV in my eyes when my friends talk to me about cars...my respect for them kinda drops. [because they have nothing else to talk about...not because they like cars] you can probably equate my story to a time when a friend talked to you about something you don't care for....i've had a friend tell me about all the anime he watches...its not really my thing, and i have no clue what the hell he is talking about when he goes on a name-dropping frenzy.

Domeremy
01-06-2008, 02:11 AM
i keep all my lame hobbies secret from EVERYONE.

i used to watch anime in high school and play on the football and rugby team. i woulda got shit ripped outta me haha.
I would have dissed the shit out of you, even if i liked w/e you liked because it was the cool thing to do.

yep, pretty much...i participate in "cool" hobbies...and sometimes my dedication to them gets the best of me when i start talking about them. now, i don't talk about them at all....i just mention that i do them. if they want to learn more, i invite them to one of my events instead of breaking down every little detail about the culture.

also, i'm not a car guy...but when some of my friends start telling me about their GZ450 TURBO XL with stickshift duel transmission drifting tire whatevers....i just wanna shoot myself. its a big DLV in my eyes when my friends talk to me about cars...my respect for them kinda drops. [because they have nothing else to talk about...not because they like cars] you can probably equate my story to a time when a friend talked to you about something you don't care for....i've had a friend tell me about all the anime he watches...its not really my thing, and i have no clue what the hell he is talking about when he goes on a name-dropping frenzy.
Dual transmission? WTF?!?! Where can i get one of those?

DSLupus
01-06-2008, 02:40 AM
I will admit though that way way way back, I had a LTR that griped about me having "Misfits" and horror movie posters on my wall...at my parents house. Her "real" gripe wasn't about that, but rather about me being a "freak" about it, and not paying attention to where I was going in life in general.

At least you had good taste in music. ;)


You made it seem like your life should be an open book and you can talk about anything to anyone. My point is you cant tell the cops certain things and you cant tell girls certain things.

That wasn't what I was aiming for, though.

My entire point was that if you have something in your life that you enjoy and get some good out of, then the people who actually care about you aren't going to fault you for that.

If you've decided to have a long-term relationship with a woman, she's probably not going to mind the fact that every now and again, you get together with your buddies to play Halo and Guitar Hero for a couple of hours. She's probably not going to care that you have the entire set of Cowboy Bebop DVDs. And she probably won't make a fuss over the fact that you take martial arts, even though she has no interest in it herself.


Maybe its just me but i find certain hobbies are NEVER associated with cool people.

You said yourself that there are always exceptions.


Depending on what the hobby is, you really might need to quit it if its considered really nerdy.

You might need to quit if it's dominating your life and you're not taking any good from it.


i keep all my lame hobbies secret from EVERYONE.

i used to watch anime in high school and play on the football and rugby team. i woulda got shit ripped outta me haha.

High school is the most cutthroat, cliquish social organization I've ever seen. Bad example.


[because they have nothing else to talk about...not because they like cars]

Bingo.


you can probably equate my story to a time when a friend talked to you about something you don't care for....i've had a friend tell me about all the anime he watches...its not really my thing, and i have no clue what the hell he is talking about when he goes on a name-dropping frenzy.

Yeah, I've seen those types. That's where it stops being a hobby and starts being a problem.

Part of the issue is that people like that immerse themselves so thoroughly in this pursuit... and then don't do anything with it.

My sister likes anime and comics, but she doesn't just watch it. She's learning how to write and draw so she can make her own comics.

A friend of mine is really into metal. But rather than being a Nile fanboy, he's writing and recording his own stuff.

There was a post over at the Fast Seduction forums I found about 6 months ago that was a major eureka for me. The guy turned his love of photography, flight simulators, and aviation history into a chance to be a photojournalist. After a couple years of pursuing that, he can now tell women that he was hanging out of a helicopter getting shots of the Arabian desert.

His five steps toward building a stronger identity were as follows:

1. Exapnd your interests in a more creative and ambitious direction.
2. Start creating things of value to a larger part of society and market them.
3. If you like what you're doing, make a plan where you'll be with it in five years.
4. Hand out with likeminded people and become part of a successful crowd with similar interests.
5. Intergrate this identity with the other bits of your life and attract people with different interests.

As I said, a hobby enriches your life. An obsession controls it.

Aaron AO
01-06-2008, 05:22 AM
lol worst thing was i was in the jock clique even though i never liked them cos i was always first team (my best mate since like secondary school 1st year was the captain and the teachers used to dig me for some reason). only other guy who knew was my mate james who was in the 2nd string. he was goodlooking and me and him used to go out on the pull together but he liked anime since first year like me. so me and him sometimes used to be talking about it and people used to eavesdrop and be like "what the fuck are you talking about" but me and him used to naturally dhv as if we were talking about the coolest shit in the world. in reality we were talking about anime. =/

i generally thing no hobbies are that great. its always like "ok"... "thats cool"... unless its common ground with someone else and even then, you dont really look for your partner to share the same wierd hobbies as you. and hobbies imo are always obsessive to a certain degree. right now i have zero hobbies. i have an xbox 360 with 10 games but i've played it for a total of about... 3 hours maximum. i have not watched anime for years. i even quit sports teams because i was getting so obsessesed with football to the extent i'd try and get a girl talking about it or i'd simply not talk to a girl if she supported man utd (rival team) or i'd start ripping the shit out of people who can't play or don't understand what the fuck they're talking about. the only thing i do is body building but i've stopped that due to my exams. even then, im not really that enthusiastic anymore about working out. i've done it since i was like 12 or 13 so its more of what i've been grown up with now.

silverghost
01-06-2008, 08:35 AM
Colin said:

Don't forget girls have "sex parties" where they have all sorts of sex toys and devices on display for them to indulge...and purchase.

Man i seriously live in the wrong country lol

Domeremy
01-06-2008, 06:22 PM
My entire point was that if you have something in your life that you enjoy and get some good out of, then the people who actually care about you aren't going to fault you for that.
YA they will. Look some activities are just considered nerdy and cool people will diss you and put you down if like those things.


If you've decided to have a long-term relationship with a woman, she's probably not going to mind the fact that every now and again, you get together with your buddies to play Halo and Guitar Hero for a couple of hours. She's probably not going to care that you have the entire set of Cowboy Bebop DVDs. And she probably won't make a fuss over the fact that you take martial arts, even though she has no interest in it herself.
Halo, Cowboy Bebop and martial arts don't affect you image equally. Playing halo is mainstreem and it wont necessarly make you look like a nerd. Anime will; no exceptions. Martial arts, depending on what it is can ruin your image.


You said yourself that there are always exceptions.
The exceptions only work when i say they do;) No but seriously Anime, D&D, and Star Trek for example will ALWAYS make you seem nerdy.


You said yourself that there are always You might need to quit if it's dominating your life and you're not taking any good from it.
You need to quit if it ruins your image not only if its dominating your life.


You said yourself that there are always High school is the most cutthroat, cliquish social organization I've ever seen. Bad example.
For the Record, middle and elementary school are a lot more cutthroat. But still you learn a lot of important lessons in high school (its were all the naturals perfect their stuff). One of the things you need to learn is how to fit it and BE COOL. Nerdy stuff destroys your coolness which needless to say is a BAD THING.

HenryHotspur
01-06-2008, 06:55 PM
Come on guys attraction doesnt turn off when you do 1 thing right.

f you use that hobby on your first interraction yes its a turn off. If you say it as part of my other hobbies on 3rd-4th date and/or after we had some amazing sex TRUST me on this, she wont friggin care.

Women dont find football interesting shall all the guys that watch football stop watching it because the girls dont like it?

I can't speak for everyone else, but you and I are clearly talking past each other since nothing you wrote in response to me here goes against what I'm saying.

You get more and more leeway the more someone is vested in you. Although I didn't specify such, I was really talking about your first few interactions, and thinking, primarily, pre-sex.

And, absolutely, being beta about your hobbies is as bad - or worse -than having bad hobbies.

But, at the risk of getting into a semantic argument, you seem to be saying that certain hobbies don't hurt you if you're alpha enough about them. But I think this isn't true. I think the hobbies hurt you ... but that being alpha helps you, so that if you handle it right the net effect may be positive.

Your example of watching football is a good one.

If, in one of your first interactions, you tell a girl that you spend most of your weekends in front of the TV watching sports, the effect will be negative. Probably less negative because watching football is more socially acceptable, but negative nonetheless. On the other hand, what if you told her that you spend the same amount of time scuba diving?

I'd argue that the later is positive, BEFORE you take into account how you talk about it.

Now, you could talk about it in a beta way, which would end up hurting you, just like you could talk about chess in an alpha way, which would not. But all this means is that the nature of the activity itself, and it's perceived social value, is either positive or negative.

And while it's vitally important to take your lesson, and understand that the way you talk about something CAN overpower the associations of the activity itself, I think, by your own admission (eg, it'll hurt you in your first interaction) you actually agree that there are hobbies that have negative value.

So the takeaway should be - in my opinion - both to understand the effect of how you talk about what you do, and to make sure you have things to talk about which are inherently interesting.

silverghost
01-06-2008, 07:01 PM
I wont go into detail with all the stuff i disagree with you but this:


Martial arts, depending on what it is can ruin your image.

You couldnt be any more light years wrong about it. Martial arts CANNOT ruin your image. It shows you can protect her, it shows you actually learn something that helps your body and mind and also it creates a concentration and many other values that are so many that is impossible to list here. Through the years I learned (and i still learn) 5 martial arts. Many girls find it amazing when I show em how they can protect themselves if i aint around with some simple moves. Now if that demonstrates low value I think you havent met a woman before.
Also I also talk with expirience. So far none of my hobbies ever ruined my image. No women ever cared about me playing a video game or a game. Wanna know why? Because my life is balanced.
Did you go out and field tested what I said? Probably not. But u do come here to disagree without any proof in your hands. Movies are not proof, what u heard from friend's friend isnt proof. I gave you a way on a previous post on saying about your hobbies and she wont even care if amongst the other stuff u add DnD or whatever. I say again it can ruin your image if you only do this hobby too much.
Your frame/image cannot be ruined so ieasily if you have an interesting and balanced life that everyone wants to be a part of it. Remember the three rats routine? Its childish. Common sense is that girls wouldnt laugh at it. Guess again. I ve used it more than 50 times an i always get laughs out of it.

Field test before you post here. Tell me how many women that were attracted to you and you dated em, and when after some time they learned about ur hobby dumped u because of it? Ofcourse its a prerequisite that you had builded a nice frame that you are an interesting guy with a balanced life. Now if you tell me THAT girl did. Then she is the 1% and its not even worth mentioning. I really urge people to go out and try what I wrote in my previous post on how to say you do a "geeky" hobby and tell me the reactions you get. Not what reactions you think you ll get. But reactions that you ll actually get.

Anyway this is becoming a boring thread for me because even if something doesnt work for everyone else and it works for me I wont stop using it so the feedback i get here is just to show other people that you shouldnt be ashamed of yourselves and the things you like.

Also you might wanna check these links on how "lame" DnD is:

http://www.enworld.org/images/4e/4eabout4e.pdf

Also make a search on Dungeons on this page:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vin_Diesel

I bet Vin diesel never gets laid because he plays/played DnD. Point taken. Case closed. Thank you.

silverghost
01-06-2008, 07:16 PM
If, in one of your first interactions, you tell a girl that you spend most of your weekends in front of the TV watching sports, the effect will be negative.

I agree because as you say it you invest a lot of time in it. You said MOST. If you said I like to watch a game from time to time with my friends. It wont hurt you.


And while it's vitally important to take your lesson, and understand that the way you talk about something CAN overpower the associations of the activity itself, I think, by your own admission (eg, it'll hurt you in your first interaction) you actually agree that there are hobbies that have negative value.

So the takeaway should be - in my opinion - both to understand the effect of how you talk about what you do, and to make sure you have things to talk about which are inherently interesting.

Yeap if i say for example: I like to spend time with my friends because they are all great guys and I invest in having great people around me. Next weekend we ll meet up and watch football or go surfing or depending on the weather maybe play DnD.
This shows some DHVs with a (as people say) a DLV being DnD. I ll tell you one thing. If a woman starts seeing only a perfect guy without showing a weakness or a DLV she ll start thinking that u have skeletons in your closet that you dont wanna bring out. For 10 DHVs if you throw a moderate or small DLV wont do dmg. I mean its like saying i am rich and I wouldnt buy a Ferrari because it eats a lot of gas. Also I never met the perfect woman so i also need to be perfect by her standards.
On the other side if you say: Me and some geeky friends we ll go play DnD and spend 14 hours playing so dont bother me because the dragons cant wait while you can then you are all the way down to the abyss.

Also I ll show you here how a normal DHV can work against you: I was out with my friends today and we saw this Evo with twin Turbine etc etc and it drifted like hell through the corners so I got my Impreza and we raced blah blah (u go on for 3 hours about cars). Eventually she gets bored. Even if u have a cool car, even if you like high adrenaline sports, even if she likes your car because its cool, even even, if thats all you talk about she ll get turned off faster than you can say oh shit.

Its all about how you present things. If you do some Marketing you ll understand what I say:)

HenryHotspur
01-06-2008, 07:43 PM
I bet Vin diesel never gets laid because he plays/played DnD. Point taken. Case closed. Thank you.

This is what's known as a "straw man" argument.

silverghost
01-06-2008, 08:08 PM
I can disagree with 1 million ways here and still not reach into a conclusion. Bottom line is that my expirience showd me that if i do presented at the right time with the right context and frame it doesnt hurt my image. You may disagree all you wont but you wont change my reality. Back in the days if some guy told you that he went to seminars or read books to be better with women u d probably say he is a geek or crazy. So no point for argueing.:)
My last post on this thread. I made my point clear. Feel free to field test it or ignore it I wouldnt care less:)

Domeremy
01-06-2008, 09:08 PM
I can disagree with 1 million ways here and still not reach into a conclusion. Bottom line is that my expirience showd me that if i do presented at the right time with the right context and frame it doesnt hurt my image. You may disagree all you wont but you wont change my reality.
So you wont admit you might be wrong? Smart. How do you know it doesn't hurt your image? When was the last time someone actually told you, you just DLV'd yourself? Most people are just too nice to tell you that you made yourself look bad.

Back in the days if some guy told you that he went to seminars or read books to be better with women u d probably say he is a geek or crazy. So no point for argueing.:)
My last post on this thread. I made my point clear. Feel free to field test it or ignore it I wouldnt care less:)
Did you just imply you no longer think its nerdy to talk about how to get girls online? Back in the day it was nerdy, now its still nerdy; thats why you dont tell you do it.

DSLupus
01-07-2008, 01:18 PM
YA they will. Look some activities are just considered nerdy and cool people will diss you and put you down if like those things.

Then obviously, you don't have very good friends and family. Not one person in my life faults me for what I love.


Halo, Cowboy Bebop and martial arts don't affect you image equally. Playing halo is mainstreem and it wont necessarly make you look like a nerd. Anime will; no exceptions. Martial arts, depending on what it is can ruin your image.

If any of that shit can ruin your image and make you a social pariah, your image was pretty fucking weak to begin with.


The exceptions only work when i say they do;) No but seriously Anime, D&D, and Star Trek for example will ALWAYS make you seem nerdy.

Then that defeats the purpose of saying that there are always exceptions.


You need to quit if it ruins your image not only if its dominating your life.

Again, if your image is that weak, you have bigger concerns.


One of the things you need to learn is how to fit it and BE COOL. Nerdy stuff destroys your coolness which needless to say is a BAD THING.

Oh spare me. Could you sound anymore like a bad 80's RoCom?


Anyway this is becoming a boring thread for me because even if something doesnt work for everyone else and it works for me I wont stop using it so the feedback i get here is just to show other people that you shouldnt be ashamed of yourselves and the things you like.

For what it's worth, I do appreciate you backing me up on this.

I took a long break from these forums because people were dispensing "advice" that had clearly never seen the light of day, and I needed to get away from that. Still, you've done your part to help restore my faith in the community.


So you wont admit you might be wrong?

Said the pot to the kettle.

Domeremy
01-07-2008, 06:35 PM
If any of that shit can ruin your image and make you a social pariah, your image was pretty fucking weak to begin with.
That's an idealistic mindset, where you believe you can do anything and get away with it.


Said the pot to the kettle.
The difference is i am right. Lets say person A says to person B "I like anime." I am talking from the POV of person B. I know how people think because I used to make the mistake of admipting nerdy shit. Then once I actually got socially calibrated I ended up being the person who looked down on nerds. I also know others do the exact same thing because I am friends with them.

If you ever want to have a cool life and not just sarge in clubs, you have to learn the importance of maintaining an image or rep. Coincendently the cooler you because the more you relize nerdy stuff is really nerdy and just not cool

DSLupus
01-08-2008, 04:58 AM
That's an idealistic mindset, where you believe you can do anything and get away with it.

No, I'm not being idealistic. I'm speaking from experience. If you're that weak, timid, and completely uninteresting that watching Cowboy Bebop causes you to lose all of your friends and become an outcast who will never get laid, you have bigger problems.


The difference is i am right.

Don't make me laugh.


Then once I actually got socially calibrated I ended up being the person who looked down on nerds.

Then you have nothing to contribute to this thread. Why are you still here?

crh
01-08-2008, 06:03 AM
Dude. I'm not really into D&D and Star Trek, but girls love Cowboy Bebop.

As long as you don't expect them to concentrate on an entire episode, they'll often get really into the intro or a particular musical number.
Which you can then segue into putting on a Miles Davis album.

It has sufficiently low investment that you can show them why it's so cool. Whereas with the other two, you'd probably have to explain all the rules and history and they'd be really bored before the end.

DSLupus
01-08-2008, 06:10 AM
Whereas with the other two, you'd probably have to explain all the rules and history and they'd be really bored before the end.

Who says you have to? If a girl I'm seeing is really interested in what I do in my spare time, chances are she'll figure it out herself. I don't need to bend her ear as she's likely smart enough to know how to do a Google search.

TrueStory
01-08-2008, 06:54 AM
there is a way to make any hobby sound cool.

There is no such thing as hobby that's pickup counter productive. There is a frame that's pickup counter productive.


I work on databases and network systems. I am a geek. But i can make it sound cool.

I also like techno. Geeky and dorky. But i can talk about world DJ's and make it sound exciting.


It's whether you can talk about your passion in ways that it's interesting to other people...

silverghost
01-08-2008, 07:21 AM
there is a way to make any hobby sound cool.

There is no such thing as hobby that's pickup counter productive. There is a frame that's pickup counter productive.


I work on databases and network systems. I am a geek. But i can make it sound cool.

I also like techno. Geeky and dorky. But i can talk about world DJ's and make it sound exciting.


It's whether you can talk about your passion in ways that it's interesting to other people...

Amen

DSLupus
01-08-2008, 09:30 AM
It's whether you can talk about your passion in ways that it's interesting to other people...

Now we're getting somewhere. This discussion may yet be saved from stupidity.

Colin
01-08-2008, 08:40 PM
Having a "geeky side" doesn't make you a complete geek.


Two things that will really turn a girl off, and should be omitted from your personality are being CREEPY or being a LOSER, or a combo of both.

If you can get away with being into "dorky" shit without coming off as either of those, you should be fine.:rolleyes: