PDA

View Full Version : The problem with confidence: Or don't suck at life Part II!



Sovereign
02-07-2007, 06:00 PM
**Disclaimer- this DOES NOT apply to someone who has mastered their life!

Ok, since my last post was such a hit, here is the follow up. One reasonable objection to that post was, "Great, but how does one do that?"

If you didn't get my last post, and you feel that going out into the field without concentrating on mastering your life is a good thing to do, and that confidence will come with success in field. I suspect part of this post is towards you as well.

So without further adieu or anymore obnoxious disclaimers from me, here is the argument I am putting forward:

Most people have 'surface confidence', it is a confidence based solely on the approval of others. When you have affirmation from others, or a history of affirmation from others, you are more confident. When you are lacking that approval, your confidence goes down. (Hence, why so many here claim that if you go out in the field, and have success, than your confidence will increase).

This confidence is very transient and subject to having the proverbial rug pulled out from underneath you at the first sign of a bad day.

However, if your confidence is based on what you truly feel you are capable of, than it is very difficult to have it taken away. I've seen so many PUA's have a bad streak (just like a poker player would for example) and lose ALL their mojo. Taking a lot of time to recover from it. Or let's say you are simply brought down because of a bad day, you get yelled by your boss, your friend just bitched you out about something, your bills are backed up. Do you think PU knowledge as it stands right now will help you deal with that? Or the fact you had an HB9 last week will help you recover from almost being fired?? ( I can imagine the 2 or 3 responses of guys saying, "Yeah, knowing Juggler helped me deal with being thrown out of my apartment!!"...funny)

Now all these events, which can happen to anyone at anytime, will shake your confidence, impact your ability to game women, and because that confidence is surface level, the moment you hit a dry spell in the field, a great amount of damage to your ego can occur. Hence, it is a simple equation:

Surface Confidence collaspes as events in your life turn away from the validation that keeps that confidence strong, this hit to your confidence level negatively impacts your ability to game in the field, you have a string of bad sarging outings, and your confidence in that area begins to drop as well.

Mastering life is how one can combat that.

How does one do that? Well there are hundreds if not thousands of self-help books out there, or you can pop in a Tony Robbins DVD and watch it, you can listen to Demonic Confidence perhaps or simply repeat, "I am good enough, smart enough and gosh darn it people like me!" over and over. Nothing has really been shown to work long term.

The key here is two very simple points:

1) Love yourself as you would want someone else to love you.

2) Know what you are capable of based on your own internal assessment, and not on what others have told you.

The first point is quite clear, we want others to love us, take care of us, care about us, but yet look at what we do to ourselves? We don't spend our spare time improving our lives, we spend it most likely wasting away in front of a tv or computer. We eat shitty food, get our haircut once every two months, wear worn out clothes and unless we are going somewhere, generally look like crap and couldn't hold a decent conversation on any topic other than the few we happen to know.

Thing about everything you would do for someone you really really love? Do you do even half that for yourself? Think about how you would want someone who loves you to treat you? Do you treat yourself even half that good??

So other than those two points, what should one do practically? (Note, if you don't love yourself and have true inner confidence, you won't succeed or bother doing any of these things):

One of the things I realized is that in order to succeed you need to excel in anything you do. This means, if you are stuck in a job, rather than just drag yourself to work everyday, master it instead, do it to the absolute best of your ability and excel at it. It is always better to be the best at a shit job than it is to be mediocre at it. Treat everything as a skill to be learned and mastered.

Anytime you find yourself interested or intrigued about something, pick up a fucking book and read about it. Saw a show on Ancient Greece that looked cool. Buy a book (and not one with a lot of pictures) and read the damn thing. Do this often enough and you will be a really well rounded person.

Anytime you think that you want to try something like learning how to dance, cook, etc. Take a class. It is not much money, and usually one night a week, which I am sure you can fit into your busy schedule. Do this all the time and you will find you have quite a bit of talent that you did not know about.

Next time you have some extra money, unless you intend to save it, spend it on your appearance! Get better clothes, a haircut, join a gym. Spending $75 at a bar is not a good use of your money (besides, women should be buying your drinks anyway!)

And finally, pay attention to people who are socially successful!! Watch what they do and how they do it. Their mannerisms, what they talk about, etc. Watch the responses of people around them. Learn from it.

Now some of these seem obvious and this is about as surface level a guide as the confidence I talk about, but again the key here is that if you aren't doing these things, ask yourself how much you really care about improving yourself? Because if you can not do these simple tasks and take them to heart, then you can not begin to master life as something is stopping you. And that thing is self-loathing.

So yeah, you might be able to go out and successfully PU an HB9, you might even get some social proof from this and feel on top of the world. But the moment things turn the wrong way, and they always do, it comes crashing back down.

Find real confidence and love yourself enough to locate it. Unfortunately, if you have to ask how one learns to love themselves, than you need to put down the PU manuals and begin to dial a shrink to find out exactly what is going causing you to be your own worst enemy.

With love,

bUNZmc
02-07-2007, 06:53 PM
Cheers mate I've been looking for a post like this one for a loooonnnggggg time. My problem with pickup hasnt been actually been a problem with the inner game side of my game but the inner game of my life in general. Cheers

Showgun
02-07-2007, 07:43 PM
I'm voting to put this in the "Best of". Awesome post.

IMO too many people in the community focus on how to convince people (including themselves) that they're cool, and not enough time focusing on actually being cool.

I'm pretty sure I've seen the analogy on these boards before, but it's like sales. If you want to be truely successful, you need a great sales pitch AND a great product. Having one to the exclusion of the other will only get you so far.

Reasoned confidence is what it's all about.

sdnightfly
02-07-2007, 09:04 PM
Part of confidence is weathering through the rough spots, the times where your friends may not be there for you, and no one else is there to back you up, and being able to recover from it.

The people who kicked you when you're down, then when you made it back on your own, went "I always knew you could do it".

When you love yourself, it's apparent. You take better care of yourself, your persona is brighter.

The comment about excelling at anything you do is so true. You can always do something to make a process better. You can be the role model to your peers, and it's just working harder and working "smarter". You're not the one worried about job security by withholding what you know, you're the one with experience giving people assistance, helping them out, the "go to" guy. The flip side is that they also get walked over and credit taken from them, but you also don't feel tied down; you can leave when things go downhill and survive.

Meet people who have survived tragedy, so you know that if they made it through terrible situations, so can you. Tim McGraw has a song "Live like you were dying"... words to live by. Make your last day on earth a rich and fulfilling one even if that last day is 80 years from now. It could be taken at any time.

You can take classes for free, for just about anything. Community centers and libraries have the info. Discussion groups.. it really doesn't matter how old they are, the point is the interacting and growing comfortable. Home Depot, department stores, and other places have a free class in something.

People who are socially successful, if they're positive and generous with their time, if they're people that are respected and admired (and not feared), and willing to give the time of day to you, those are usually people to listen to and learn from. Some are BS artists that come across as "know it alls", but most are "good guys".

Some of the most wealthiest and good looking that can pull any woman can also be the most miserable to be around, and you may wind up being far more happier in your life than they could ever imagine themselves to be...

PhilosopherKing
02-08-2007, 10:05 AM
Hey! What the fuck is all this non-sense?

I come to the community because DavidD says I can learn to pull super- models regardless of my income, age, weight, or appearance. That all I need is a few magical lines that he will specifically teach and then HBs will be overwhelmingly attracted to me and me and my friends won't believe it!

So I send the money to get access to the secret knowledge. But then you guys go an say that I have to do all this work and change my lifestyle and not be a computer geek anymore.

That I have to work for years and become cool and lose weight and be a gold chain wearing pimp (and even harder think like one!) because that is what women ultimately find attractive. And my lines will only hide the fact that I am not that person for so long.

I did not pay money to hear that. I knew that all along, but was promised an alternative: use some magic and fool then long enough to get fucked. I feel disillusioned now and want my money back! Oh, but, fuck, the 90 day guarantees are up. Guess I am hosed!

DevilFish
02-08-2007, 09:40 PM
Hey! What the fuck is all this non-sense?

I come to the community because DavidD says I can learn to pull super- models regardless of my income, age, weight, or appearance. That all I need is a few magical lines that he will specifically teach and then HBs will be overwhelmingly attracted to me and me and my friends won't believe it!

So I send the money to get access to the secret knowledge. But then you guys go an say that I have to do all this work and change my lifestyle and not be a computer geek anymore.

That I have to work for years and become cool and lose weight and be a gold chain wearing pimp (and even harder think like one!) because that is what women ultimately find attractive. And my lines will only hide the fact that I am not that person for so long.

I did not pay money to hear that. I knew that all along, but was promised an alternative: use some magic and fool then long enough to get fucked. I feel disillusioned now and want my money back! Oh, but, fuck, the 90 day guarantees are up. Guess I am hosed!



You poor man, you definitly need to pull your life together :confused: .

Phoenix Rising
02-09-2007, 12:30 AM
Hey! What the fuck is all this non-sense?

I come to the community because DavidD says I can learn to pull super- models regardless of my income, age, weight, or appearance. That all I need is a few magical lines that he will specifically teach and then HBs will be overwhelmingly attracted to me and me and my friends won't believe it!

So I send the money to get access to the secret knowledge. But then you guys go an say that I have to do all this work and change my lifestyle and not be a computer geek anymore.

That I have to work for years and become cool and lose weight and be a gold chain wearing pimp (and even harder think like one!) because that is what women ultimately find attractive. And my lines will only hide the fact that I am not that person for so long.

I did not pay money to hear that. I knew that all along, but was promised an alternative: use some magic and fool then long enough to get fucked. I feel disillusioned now and want my money back! Oh, but, fuck, the 90 day guarantees are up. Guess I am hosed!

Okay, I see your point. You want the silver bullet to all your problems with women. Wouldn't it be great if something like that existed?

Let me break this down another way that might make some more sense. As I interpret the above, it's not about "changing your life", it's about LIVING YOUR LIFE. Every human being has at least ONE major thing they want to do with their life. Personally I have several (launch my company into a multinational corporation, run for public office as an independent and stop people from fucking up the US, learn to fly an airplane, become a black belt in some martial art, etc. etc.). Life is a journey my friend - the destination, however, changes more the further along the road we get.

Sovereign here is saying that you don't have to "change" your life. If you LIKE being a "computer geek", if you LIKE being overweight (stereotyping here, not trying to insult you), if you LIKE being a star-wars/trek nut, that's great! Keep at it! In fact, if you like being a general "geek", I encourage you to UP it a notch! The fact is that what's "cool" and attractive has nothing to do with the social stereotype you fit into. It's all about YOUR level of comfort with YOURSELF.

He's saying that you need to get your inner game together. Get your life together, your own sense of self-confidence. This is how you "internalize" game, and this is where it becomes REAL. All the lines, the routines, fake stories, tests, all that jazz aren't REAL. What happens when you get into a situation where you can't remember all that stuff? What if you're talking to an ELEVEN, not just a ten, and you just for whatever reason can't come up with it all? If you get YOUR life together, you'll internalize the game and you won't have to memorize or concoct stories at all - it'll just flow. The way nature intended by genetic design.

I'm not going to insult you for your point of view; I don't agree with it, but I would encourage you to realize that inner game should be your ultimate goal, so you're a real person. It's logically impossible to plan for ALL possible contingencies (which equal infinity), so lines, routines, and stories WILL eventually fail. It's best to have it internalized first.

Best of luck to you my friend.

Phoenix Rising
02-09-2007, 12:32 AM
PS - I second that this be placed in a "Best Of" section and/or stickied. In fact, I'd like to see more writing on this from the specialists and mPUAs here!

PhilosopherKing
02-09-2007, 10:40 AM
My post was somewhat satirical. (A bit exaggerated, just for fun.)

The point is that the marketing of the community does promise magic bullets. But then once you get here, they say, oh, you know what, there aren't really any silver bullets after all.

So given the marketing why are some people surprised that there are guys around here looking for magic bullets when that is explicitly what the marketing and hype promises?

So we get here and learn if it's really ultimately about self-help, psychotherapy, changing your lifestyle or root philosophies, whatever. Oh great! That is something we could have guessed all along. We did not the community to tell us that.

And if this community is ultimately going to be about such discussions, (which seems to be its historical trend) then: Why are the leaders of the seduction community even qualified to speak on these matters, and where are their non-trivial observations?

Roman_be
02-09-2007, 11:16 AM
One of the things I realized is that in order to succeed you need to excel in anything you do. This means, if you are stuck in a job, rather than just drag yourself to work everyday, master it instead, do it to the absolute best of your ability and excel at it. It is always better to be the best at a shit job than it is to be mediocre at it. Treat everything as a skill to be learned and mastered.


This is it. This is abso-fuckin-lutely it.


Best of.

Showgun
02-09-2007, 11:42 AM
So we get here and learn if it's really ultimately about self-help, psychotherapy, changing your lifestyle or root philosophies, whatever. Oh great! That is something we could have guessed all along. We did not the community to tell us that.

And if this community is ultimately going to be about such discussions, (which seems to be its historical trend) then: Why are the leaders of the seduction community even qualified to speak on these matters, and where are their non-trivial observations?

Psychotherapy is only a small portion of it, and really only applies to people who have really messed up views of how the world works, and in those cases the person should definitely seek professional help. I certainly wouldn't recomend taking any pseudo / pop psychology advice from someone whose only real qualificaitons have to do with running routines.

That being said, there's nothing wrong with deciding to model your behaviours after someone who's achieved success in whatever area of life you want to do well in, and there ARE people in the community who have successfully worked at and succeeded in generally getting their shit together. Learning to model their thought paterns, understanding their personal philosophies etc. will help you to better understand their behaviours, whether it's to do with seduction / relationship management, financial management or physical health.

As I said, you need both the sales pitch, and the product to be truely successful in the long run. The seduction community is especially good for learning about the sales pitch (outer game), but there are also lots of people around the community who know how to developing the product (Inner game) because they've been through it.

Sovereign
02-09-2007, 11:43 AM
Thanks everyone for the feedback and the best of noms. Much appreciated.

With love,

Phoenix Rising
02-09-2007, 12:36 PM
Psychotherapy is only a small portion of it, and really only applies to people who have really messed up views of how the world works, and in those cases the person should definitely seek professional help. I certainly wouldn't recomend taking any pseudo / pop psychology advice from someone whose only real qualificaitons have to do with running routines.

That being said, there's nothing wrong with deciding to model your behaviours after someone who's achieved success in whatever area of life you want to do well in, and there ARE people in the community who have successfully worked at and succeeded in generally getting their shit together. Learning to model their thought paterns, understanding their personal philosophies etc. will help you to better understand their behaviours, whether it's to do with seduction / relationship management, financial management or physical health.

As I said, you need both the sales pitch, and the product to be truely successful in the long run. The seduction community is especially good for learning about the sales pitch (outer game), but there are also lots of people around the community who know how to developing the product (Inner game) because they've been through it.

Showgun brings up some great points here. My theory on sales and commerce (in a non-PUA fashion) has always been that a good product can sell itself as long as people know about it. There's another saying: build a better mousetrap and the world will beat a path to your door. If you look at the pattern of scientific and technological innovation over the ages, you'll see this is true.

Therefore my own personal focus has been on getting my inner game totally solid, and THEN I'll worry about a few portions related to "the pitch". That's, in my opinion, the best way to get 10's absolutely craving your presence all the time, like heroin addicts in need of their next fix. That's what I'm after, so I have the options to choose who I want instead of having to go in search of, so to speak.

But yeah Showgun - right on the money man. And PhilospherKing - I understand your point once again. Nobody's saying you HAVE to jump STRAIGHT into mastering your inner game at all - use the routines, lines, storytelling techniques, etc. But just realize that nothing good ever came easy; if you don't have to work for it, it isn't worth anything.

PhilosopherKing
02-09-2007, 01:46 PM
I am not sure that the leaders of this community have the inner game answers I seek. But we shall see where the current trend leads...

Personally I think I am going to spend the next year reading Carl Jung, hanging around strip clubs discussing his philosophies with strippers. (They just love that shit!)

Hopefully that will fix my inner game issues, give me a ton of new routines, and lead to a few fool's mates... :)

Roman_be
02-10-2007, 05:11 AM
Something that has really helped me when times get rough, is using the logically factual affirmation that moods will pass. I will not always feel like this. Emotions change. Then just as affirmed, the next day, it has passed.

Just those few simple lines repeated to ones self when feeling low (we all have erm) can really keep the confidence strong. And its proven fact. Not just words.

Charisma/Ego
02-10-2007, 09:34 AM
No doubt in my mind, that this post belongs in the Best of.

After a few months on a dry spell, and being stuck on a military base in the middle of nowhere - i have, as you plainly stated, 'became my own worst enemy'. I should be making the best of my life, take Ju-Jitsu, theathre, read books, go out with everyone (even if sets are small in number).

This post has re-kindled something in me, and i highly appreciate that.

So once again....BEST OF!

AlaskaDan
02-10-2007, 01:48 PM
This is pretty much what most people figure out getting into the game. IT is not the methods that give you success, it is your ATTITUDE change that gets you results. You start looking at everything more postivelsy and you start treating people better. People who may have rubbed you the wrong way in the past you now get along with. It is all inner game when it comes down to it. Yes there are certain things you can do and not do for better results, but the main part is matersering your attitude.

Roman_be
02-21-2007, 12:17 PM
I want to RE-add to this topic with something else that majorly changed my attitude and behaviours.

"When you reach a state where you are no longer concerned about yourself – that is, when you forget yourself or you can take your own safe existence for granted – you will have achieved a state that will allow you to be successful with and influence other
people."


Consider what most people do all day long. They think about themselves. They worry about themselves. They’re afraid for their insecurities and their shortcomings. They are too preoccupied with keeping themselves safe.
Narcissism is the delusion that we are more important to the world than we really are. Many people have mistaken narcissism for self-centered behavior, but they’re not the same. Selfish behavior is just a focus on yourself that doesn’t take other people into account.

True narcissism is the belief that others are as attentive to our behaviors and
faults as we are. That they see our mistakes and are all secretly taking pleasure in our problems. Think about this for a bit. We all think that everyone is watching us and making judgments about us all day long, but the reality is that everyone else is too busy … well, thinking about himself! No one really thinks about us as much as we might like to believe.


-----------

And it's so true.