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View Full Version : Trying to get a grasp and understand the paradoxes of rsd and LS teachings



WannabeJock
08-12-2011, 01:16 PM
So obiovusly both companies get their students to make progress and gets them laid. However, there are some fundamental differences in the teachings of RSD and LS. There are things going agains eachother and somehow it still "works". Im trying to get a better understanding of them two, and I really think people would benefit from it.


Let me start with the first one. RSD say that you should never ever even worry about trying to create attraction, you should just ASSUME attraction and hold that frame and eventually it will become a self fulfilling prophecy (the girl will notice ure not being reactive to her, drawing your confidence from yourselef and not her responses which communicates u are higher value than her hence making her attracted).

They say that even TRYING to "create attraction" with a girl is very easy to come off as button pushing and reinforce the fact that you are "not enough" and that you have to do something just to get another person to like you (in this case push preselection buttons, being challenging, jokes etc).

If I REALLY think about that, It kinda makes sense, the guy Im out with on a regular basis, some who are EXTREMELY good with girls, dont give a FUCK about attraction switches or "making girls like them", they just go in with the frame they are the shit and they doesnt give a fuck what the girls think anyway, the girls almost always feel this and they become interested.

However, then you have LoveSystems who say that you have to CREATE attraction due to using attraction switches, push/pull, teasing etc etc etc. This also makes sense, I mean, you gotta say SOMETHING right? But at the same time, as I said, doesnt this just reinforce the fact that you NEED to do stuff to get girls to like you? That you are not enough as you are? doesnt this build some kind of virus in your head so u always feel that u have to proove yourself to other people to feel good about yourself?


Another thing that RSD say is that comfort really aint that useful for getting girls, girls go for indicators of social value ALWAYS and they can change from second to second, so even if u have some cool connection with a girl, if another more alpha dude with more status than u comes around, he can easily get your girls attention and steal her due to his frame, even if u and the girl 2 seconds ago had amazing connection.

This make sense on one level, cause girls out there are VERY often cheating on their boyfriends with more alpha dudes, and IM sure they have more connectin with their 10months boyfriend than the confident assertive idiot at the bar, but still it happends way too often.

Then LS say that comfort IS the game, that all the other shit is just to get to comfort as fast as possible.



Then we have LS who also say that u need a structure, and they teach it. You need different techniques etc etc, Open, Transition, Attraction, QUalification, Comfort Seduction. Which makes sense, I mean, you HAVE To open, you HAVE to get into a conversation etc.

Then RSD say that FUCK all that bullshit, EVERYTHING is the same, when you open, if ure a cool attractive dude she WILL eventually become attracted, usually very fasy, so fuck transitioning and fuck attraction, just fucking open her and self amuse and draw her into your reality. They say that qualification and investment isnt to think about, she WILL invest emotionally anyway when she see she cant control you, she will try to get you to react, try to control you and when she can see you as like a wild animal that does whatever it wanna do, she will invest massively to make you hers. RSD also say that the comfort stage aint needed, all thats needed is she is comfortable enough with u to have sex, and if ure a guy who are none judgemental, present and having fun, she will enjoy your presence hence become comfortable with you.


I dont wanna start some bullshit RSD VS LS thread again, Im tired of that, however It would be GREAT if some intructor/advanced dude could clarify these things up because I KNOW there are ALOT of guys out there confused about this.


Thankyou

Th3_Jester
08-12-2011, 01:32 PM
There isn't much to clarify other than the fact that there are different approach styles you can utilize. It's not about calling one system wrong, and another right. It's about finding which system (or combination of systems) is right for YOU.

This is only discovered through trial and error because you know yourself better than anyone else.

I say try all the variations of approach until you feel you've hit the bullseye for your own personality and preference.

inconspicuous
08-12-2011, 01:41 PM
It's all very zen. How do you prove you're confident? The harder you try, the less confident you look. How do you stop trying? Trying to stop trying is a contradiction.

Basically, LS tells you step by step what you would do IF you didn't give a fuck. If you don't give a fuck, you'll pass every shit test by ignoring it, and you'll overcome all sexual resistance by not getting frustrated or pissy about it. If you don't give a fuck, you'll create attraction because you'll honest to god not give a shit about making fun of a girl the way you would make fun of a drinking buddy, which is the attitude behind push-pull. If you don't give a fuck, you'll qualify a girl, and say "man, if you think Harry Potter is the best movie, this is NEVER gonna work." And if you don't give a fuck, you'll be attractive enough that girls will qualify themselves to you without you initiating it.

RSD sounds like they try to keep it natural, which is what you should aim for in the long run. But LS is good because it breaks it down. For people who are totally gameless, you can follow the blueprint and have success. And for people who get lucky now and then, they can use LS to figure out which step or skill they need to work on. And LS can explain where you went wrong if things don't always work out.

WannabeJock
08-12-2011, 01:51 PM
Great responses so far, seems there was no problem holding the "rsd vs LS muahah" frame out.

Again, Im glad for ALL the responsese to get a 100% understanding so you can make it go "click" and say "aha I UNDERSTAND" so again, please keep out the controversioal shit about which is the best method.

BnG
08-13-2011, 12:55 AM
Are there guys out there who are SUPER nice and get tons of pussy?
Are there guys out there who are SUPER dicks and get tons of pussy?
Are there guys out there who use RSD and get tons of pussy?
Are there guys out there who use LSS and get tons of pussy?
Is there more than one style out there that works?
Do many pua's over analyze FUCKING EVERYTHING?
Do many of those pua's not realize that at the root, these boot camps just focus on getting you too approach women?


The answer is yes.

Prada
08-13-2011, 06:58 PM
LSD sounds more for guys with very tight inner game and possibly very good looking. I don't forsee a "beginner" jumping to that style. I guess its two different styles like day versus night game. I don't think a one size fits all game works for everyone. I adapt my style depending on the environment and character of the girl.

For example, I remember while in Univ. there was this hot foreign student, very reserved, humble and studious. I saw her in the library so I had a LS type approach. Worked

Another time it was Sat. 4AM, people exiting clubs and chit chatting. I used more of a RSD approach. Worked

BlackbeltMethod
08-13-2011, 10:49 PM
So obiovusly both companies get their students to make progress and gets them laid. However, there are some fundamental differences in the teachings of RSD and LS. There are things going agains eachother and somehow it still "works". Im trying to get a better understanding of them two, and I really think people would benefit from it.
It's a matter of teaching semantics and perspective.

Here's a good analogy: The fable of the blind men and the elephant
Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blind_men_and_an_elephant


Let me start with the first one. RSD say that you should never ever even worry about trying to create attraction, you should just ASSUME attraction and hold that frame and eventually it will become a self fulfilling prophecy (the girl will notice ure not being reactive to her, drawing your confidence from yourselef and not her responses which communicates u are higher value than her hence making her attracted).

RSD - Fuck routines. Just "Not give a shit." / "Be self-validated" / "Be Selfish" i.e. "Do what you want".
LS - Here are some routines. These will teach you to "Not give a shit" / "Be self-validated" / "Be Selfish" i.e. "Do what you want".


They say that even TRYING to "create attraction" with a girl is very easy to come off as button pushing and reinforce the fact that you are "not enough" and that you have to do something just to get another person to like you (in this case push preselection buttons, being challenging, jokes etc).

RSD - Be a super cool guy. Be your most attractive self.
LS - Learn how to see The Matrix itself. There is no spoon. :D


If I REALLY think about that, It kinda makes sense, the guy Im out with on a regular basis, some who are EXTREMELY good with girls, dont give a FUCK about attraction switches or "making girls like them", they just go in with the frame they are the shit and they doesnt give a fuck what the girls think anyway, the girls almost always feel this and they become interested.

That's because they're being direct, confident, and congruent with their personalities. The downside is that they are not making any conscious effort to try new things or improve themselves. Do what you've always done and you will continue to receive what you've always received.

I know Naturals like that. They pull girls and they have no clue why it works for them. These kinds of people don't understand why I "follow the book". They don't even get it when I start talking about breakthroughs I've made over personal sticking points. It all comes down to the lowest common denominator of "are you getting laid?"

You are thinking of "auto-pilot". Routines and openers and lines are training wheels. With enough practice it'll become so automatic that you'll be be more successful than them.

You'll see The Matrix and them in slow motion, so to speak.


However, then you have LoveSystems who say that you have to CREATE attraction due to using attraction switches, push/pull, teasing etc etc etc. This also makes sense, I mean, you gotta say SOMETHING right? But at the same time, as I said, doesnt this just reinforce the fact that you NEED to do stuff to get girls to like you? That you are not enough as you are? doesnt this build some kind of virus in your head so u always feel that u have to proove yourself to other people to feel good about yourself?

Attraction is a consequence of what you communicate and how you present yourself. Realtime interactions happen so fast. That's why it is necessary to go out and train your autopilot to be the best it can be. You shouldn't be consciously thinking about them in your interactions. Love Systems teachers that thinking too much is shooting yourself in the foot. Thinking too much fucks up your interaction. The reason why Magic Bullets is relevant is it allows you to take what you are already doing and level it up into "shit Im already doing lv2."

Then you take that and level it up into "shit I'm already doing lv3."

Like a videogame. Think Fallout3. Or Final Fantasy with their "fire", "fira", "firaga".

It basically tells you what you are doing right i.e. why your random, drunken debauchery non-sense attracts women.

P.S. Considering Tyler Durden's reputation of breaking down theory to the subatomic level, it's surprising that RSD would have a hate-on against something like the attraction switches.

Also, your realtime thinking shouldn't include: "I HAVE ATTRACTION. NOW I MUST QUALIFY."


Another thing that RSD say is that comfort really aint that useful for getting girls, girls go for indicators of social value ALWAYS and they can change from second to second, so even if u have some cool connection with a girl, if another more alpha dude with more status than u comes around, he can easily get your girls attention and steal her due to his frame, even if u and the girl 2 seconds ago had amazing connection.

1) AMOG
2) You're running comfort too early if he can just come up and steal her away.


This make sense on one level, cause girls out there are VERY often cheating on their boyfriends with more alpha dudes, and IM sure they have more connectin with their 10months boyfriend than the confident assertive idiot at the bar, but still it happends way too often.

Do some field reports and report back to us with your findings.


Then LS say that comfort IS the game, that all the other shit is just to get to comfort as fast as possible.

According to Savoy, Game starts when you leave the house.


Then we have LS who also say that u need a structure, and they teach it. You need different techniques etc etc, Open, Transition, Attraction, QUalification, Comfort Seduction. Which makes sense, I mean, you HAVE To open, you HAVE to get into a conversation etc.

Then RSD say that FUCK all that bullshit, EVERYTHING is the same, when you open, if ure a cool attractive dude she WILL eventually become attracted, usually very fasy, so fuck transitioning and fuck attraction, just fucking open her and self amuse and draw her into your reality. They say that qualification and investment isnt to think about, she WILL invest emotionally anyway when she see she cant control you, she will try to get you to react, try to control you and when she can see you as like a wild animal that does whatever it wanna do, she will invest massively to make you hers. RSD also say that the comfort stage aint needed, all thats needed is she is comfortable enough with u to have sex, and if ure a guy who are none judgemental, present and having fun, she will enjoy your presence hence become comfortable with you.

How's that working out for you anyway?


I dont wanna start some bullshit RSD VS LS thread again, Im tired of that, however It would be GREAT if some intructor/advanced dude could clarify these things up because I KNOW there are ALOT of guys out there confused about this.


If you haven't read Magic Bullets, or the LS. Triad Model, or Soul's Daytime Dating book, I suggest you do so now.

Then go out and do some field reports.

Then report back to us with your findings.

We'll be here to troubleshoot your sticking points if you need it and help you succeed in your endeavours.

- DJ