RSD Cumulative Reviews

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    RSD Cumulative Reviews

    Has anyone been to a London RSD bootcamp or one anywhere else in the world for that matter?


       

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    Review: RSD bootcamp - A complete ripoff.

    If you are considering taking a RSD bootcamp, I urge you to read this review first.
    Last November I signed up for a RSD bootcamp and I took the Feb 3-5 bootcamp in NYC. While I knew that it isn't a magic pill going into it, I was promised by TD personally over the phone that the bootcamp would be tailored to my individual needs, and would shave a minimum of one year off my game. On top of that, they claim these things on their website:
    "1- We take you out into malls, cafes, restaurants, and clubs to demonstrate how to meet women right in front of you.
    2- We act as your personal wingman and meet women together.
    3- We get you doing it step-by-step (what to say, the right body language, how to create sexual tension, everything.
    4- We work with you and give you the kind of potent and crucial feedback that you need to get this area mastered until you've got it sorted out.
    The program is structured so that even if you've never approached a woman in your entire life, you'll feel totally comfortable and at ease."
    Lies. All lies. They fulfill none of these things; it's just marketing hype to lure an unsuspecting individual into giving them his or her money.
    Before I took my bootcamp, I sent out multiple emails to my instructor and the coordinators stating what I'd like to do during my bootcamp, and what I'd like to accomplish. Because this was supposed to be a customized bootcamp, I requested the majority of the time to be spent in field, as well as adequate demonstration so I could see what "good" looks like, and have a role model to follow. When I brought these things up to my instructor upon meeting him, after he received my email and promised to fulfill my requests, he told me "We'll see." We'll see? Last I checked, I am the customer, am I not?
    I arrived at my bootcamp early in NY to meet my instructor. I was actually thrilled at who my instructor was, as I'd heard he lived for over a year in the Project Hollywood mansion with Mystery and his gang, so his game had to be top notch right? On top of that, it was a 2on1 bootcamp as opposed to a 4on2, meaning more sets, and more attention. Things were looking great. To all those who knew me beforehand, I was very much looking forward to this experience, and went into it with an open mind.
    Or so I thought... My instructor was actually nervous and a bit fidgety upon meeting him. Now I can understand nervousness is human, but it struck me as odd as this is supposed to be a guy who's a mPUA, and has conducted hundreds of workshops. I would soon find out that he is indeed a social robot, and lacks the ability to vibe on anything else besides game. There were many times where I, the other student, and my instructor would be walking down the street, in complete silence. I guess the term "Real Social Dynamics" is used very loosely.
    The first two days of the bootcamp ran from 7:00pm to 2:00am, and we'd spent from 7-11 in a boring seminar, where my instructor drudged on and on, preaching theory and material that I already knew, and can easily be researched via the asf archives (hence why I requested the majority to be field work, and was promised to me beforehand). We'd spent the other 2 and a half hours in a club, where my instructor pushed me into sets. Here's the thing though.. he refused to demonstrate any sets whatsoever. He flat out said no. In fact, during the course of the three days (21 hours) I witnessed him approach a total of four sets, only one that I could actually hear him in. I was highly upset by this as one of the main reasons I decided to take this bootcamp was to see how the masters do it live and up close. I now have second doubts about my instructors ability to perform, as I feel he was making excuses just so he didn't have to approach.
    As far as feedback went, here was the feedback I got after approaching sets at the end of the night. "Good job on approaching man, you did what 99% of asf can't do."
    That was it. No constructive feedback at all. In fact I was so upset with the way things were going, and the complete lack of caring by my instructor, that I actually left the program early one of those days, with no desire to continue. It was so bad, I was tempted to not even attend day three at all.
    Day 3 was a total joke. It ran from 11pm to 6pm. We spent the first five hours of that in another seminar, going over the exact same material we had gone over the first two days. The second hour we went shopping at various clothes stores so my instructor could show us what's currently in style. That was the magic makeover they promise. You can get this same experience watching the fashion channel. Finally, the last hour we spent in field. That's right, a mere one hour on Sunday was spent doing field work. Highly disappointing.
    After this complete waste of money, I emailed TylerDurden the following day, stating my concerns, giving him a chance to somewhat remedy the situation. His replies contained the context of "We have your money now, and there's nothing we're going to do for you." In fact, I didn't even want my money back. I would of liked a second bootcamp where things are done right. I even tried to negotiate for a single phone coaching session, where I could at least learn something. No deal. He even had my instructor call to confront me on why I thought the bootcamp was bad. Very disappointing, considering TD states claims that their customer service has gone up 1000% over the past two years.
    So if you like throwing money away, the RSD bootcamp may be for you. Before you consider spending that $1500, I would suggest giving yourself a makeover, donating that money to the homeless, or hell, put it in a brief case, go to the center of your city, open it, and let it blow away in the wind. The money will be better off, trust me.
    Hell, if you'd like, I can give you the exact same bootcamp experience for a mere $20.
    To sum up:
    Pros:
    -I got a new pair of jeans which cost me $283.
    Cons:
    -Over the course of three days (21 hours) we spent a mere 6 hours in field.
    -Over the course of three days, my instructor demonstrated a total of four sets and refused to do more, despite my numerous requests and pleads.
    -Seminar material was unoriginal, and can be found on these forums for free.
    -Complete lack of customer service.
    -Complete lack of caring about the students success.
    -The entire bootcamp experience.
    If you have any other questions regarding my experience, please don't hesitate to email me at sliek0722@aol.com. I am the fourth guy in my lair who has had a bad experience with RSD, and I will be the last. I'd like to make sure you guys make an informed decision before signing up with these guys.
       

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    My instructor refused to do sets, even though I asked him many _many_ times. Each time was a different excuse. We spent very little time in field as well. We'd get to the club at 11pm, and be done at 1:30am. Sunday we were in field from 5pm-6pm. I didn't receive any walkthroughs in field, and no feedback as well.
       

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    I've heard many many people recommend that before taking a bootcamp, no matter what company it's from, to make sure you know the reviews that particular instructor receives. This is advice that should always be followed in my opinion.
    However, if you thought your instructor was a mPUA I wouldn't blame you for being dissapointed.
    If anyone else has reviews of RSD please post them as a seperate thread!
    I'd love to hear some good detailed reviews about them as well.
    Please include as much detail in your review as you can.
    A review that states "They were awesome and I got my money's worth" is shit, just like "they sucked..." is crap as well.
       

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    Quote Originally Posted by Swinger555
    My instructor refused to do sets, even though I asked him many _many_ times. Each time was a different excuse. We spent very little time in field as well. We'd get to the club at 11pm, and be done at 1:30am. Sunday we were in field from 5pm-6pm. I didn't receive any walkthroughs in field, and no feedback as well.
    Sorry to hear you had a bad experience. It's a lot of money and time to commit to something and be so disappointed. It's also too bad Tyler is not more accomodating -- it was right of you to complain. If RSD has a bum instructor, they need to be aware of it to protect their reputation. If they don't, they will suffer in the long run. They have probably lost future business due to your review, whereas if they'd handled it better and you were satisfied with their response, it could have brought in future business. Maybe they're "business robots."
    I've generally heard good things about most of the higher profile workshops out there (especially Love Systems).
       

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    Well RSD is starting to sound really sketchy now.
    Maybe back to Mystery, although I'll have to wait till im 21 and they don't do day game.
    Is there anyone in Mystery Method company that doesn't endorse canned material? Do any of the structures lay women with no canned material whatsoever?
    hrmp its only 2 days of field work and 1:4 instructor student ratio, wtf?
    Last edited by Refrusloi; 02-2006-13 at 01:32 PM.
       

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    Quote Originally Posted by Refrusloi
    Swinger555:
    I'm interested, what was the name of your instructor?
    If you do not want to say it here, please email me at Refrusloi@hotmail.com
    I was thinking of taking a RSD bootcamp but The reviews are so mixed. Some phenomenal and some horror stories ( like yours ). Dude, I felt pissed JUST READING THAT REVIEW!
    Are there any instructors you guys would recommend? What about if you do 1on1 and they come to you? It's not like I'd get Tyler so who are the other good instructors in the USA?
    Is RSD under 21? If RSD is 21 and over you are probably better off taking a Love Systems bootcamp instead. I have yet to hear a negative review and they offer a money back guarantee which I am pretty sure no one has EVER taken them up on
    View Full Profile: Click Here 200 + Reviews (Most In Company History): http://www.theattractionforums.com/t...iew_fader.html (watch my journey from student to approach coach, to instructor, to master instructor, to stripper destroyer).

    Best quote from a workshop review ever "Overall this bootcamp was a short colombian 10, his teaching ability is a 10, and his game is a 10."

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    Xaneus has at least one damning review out there.
       

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    ok, I'm glad to hear I wasn't the only one who had a bad experience with the RSD bootcamps.
    I took one a few months ago, and although it wasn't a "total rip off", I do feel that my money would have been better spent elsewhere.
    I had the same thing with my instructors, no demonstrations at all, they just pointed out sets for me to open without really teaching anything.
    the only results they got were that one of them got a kiss (more like a peck on the lips) from this chubby chick that I wouldn't even approach, not much of a demonstration for someone who's supposed to be a mPUA...
    one of my instructors was half asleep most of the time, and the material they handed out was full of typos and spelling mistakes... very unprofessional for people who call themselves "executive coaches"...
    they did do a great job with the fashion consult, but I don't think that's worth all the money I spent.
       

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maverick
    I had a friend that took the RSD Toronto bootcamp with TD. TD does approach sets and he did very well aparently. However the bootcamp mainly consisted of the guy being pushed into sets. Not much theory - this can be good or bad depending on how you look at it.
    - Mav
    I can testify to this, as I have myself been bootcamped by TD, and that was the basic format of it. If I recall well, I'd say that he probably did 10-12approaches the entire weekend, but since he pushed me into so many more, it didn't seem like he did many ( I believe I did around 50-70 sets that weekend, if not more).
    He made us do a lot of the work. Not a whole lot of material....luckily for me I was very good socially and had a good base. However, I will admit it was still a bit scary doing all these sets that first night. This may or may not be a good thing, depending on the student's skill level and attitude. I didn't have any real knowledge of ASF techniques prior to bootcamp, and I made out ok. I was pure vibing on day 1 pretty much, and more material day 2 & day 3.
    As for him, he did well in set...very good frame control and delivery of material. The one set that stood out out of all of them, was this street set he opened 4 am on our last night, while we were just shootin' the sh** on the sidewalk, bootcamp over. It was the most impressive set I've ever seen, really engaging two HB8.5s for like 30-45 minutes, just a stream of storytelling, negs, push/pull, routines, etc. The other student and I were enjoying the show very much, and it was very inspiring. I didn't even want to split the set......to enjoy watching more than winging says a lot!! The girls were smiling and laughing, and we were in essence doing the same as spectators 2 feet away. It was at that moment that I finally got the big demonstration I was promised!
    He then gave us a nice wrap up, and talked about a lot of things. If you come in with the right attitude and willing to do the work like a soldier, you will have fun bootcamping with TD (if he still does it). I can't speak about him on his notoriety with the community, but 1 on 1 as a teacher, he was a real cool, down to earth guy. Clearly a big shock to read what I read about him in The Game.
    I'm not in position to rate RSD vs. MM vs. PU101, or TD vs. Mystery vs. Sensei, etc etc. But if you're doing a bootcamp for the first time and want to get good at A1, A2 consistently, it can happen with the *right* RSD team.
    I came away very excited after the bootcamp as I finally was a certifiable approach machine, and I was getting attraction often , and hooking a good portion of sets. It was a high that lasted a few days. State was not an issue for me for awhile after I took the bootcamp.
    Last edited by Jota; 03-2006-09 at 09:18 AM.
       

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maverick
    I had a friend that took the RSD Toronto bootcamp with TD. TD does approach sets and he did very well aparently. However the bootcamp mainly consisted of the guy being pushed into sets. Not much theory - this can be good or bad depending on how you look at it.
    - Mav
    I think the idea of no theory is terrible. It doenst give you a framework. Sure you can say oh your body language was off blah blah blah thats why you lost the set but i would rather know all about a1 - s3 over someone critique my approaches anyway. Its like being an nba player and someone talking about your shots and why your shooting form was bad as opposed to explaining why you should have been here and the theory of the tri-angle offense. I went to the vegas seminar, didnt get ANY approaches critiqued c ause i was silver, assimilated the theory and my last week in nyc I was like a new man. Theory first always
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    Quote Originally Posted by Refrusloi
    Well RSD is starting to sound really sketchy now.
    Maybe back to Mystery, although I'll have to wait till im 21 and they don't do day game.
    Is there anyone in Mystery Method company that doesn't endorse canned material? Do any of the structures lay women with no canned material whatsoever?
    hrmp its only 2 days of field work and 1:4 instructor student ratio, wtf?
    You have some weird ideas about Mystery Method.
    You don't have to wait until you're 21 for either day-game or for bootcamps in Canada or for seminar-only.
    We do do day-game.
    Ratios vary from 1-1 to 1-3 depending on what program and it's all upfront before you pay a dime.
    Nothing in MM requires canned material.
    All of our programs - unlike certain other ones - have a 100% money back guarantee. We stand by our work and by our name.
       

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jota
    What would say is the major difference that points you this way?
    Better teaching structure? More material? More infield coaching/calibration?
    I'd like to do a MM bootcamp in the future. I'm in similar shoes to you.
    First off they have a structured THEORETICAL seminar that they have done 100's if not 1000's of times. I, personally, need theory. I cant be told do this or do that without knowing why I am being told to do it. The MM system is LINEAR. It is an actual STRUCTURE. So at any point in an interaction I know where I am and what I should be doing.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jota
    What would say is the major difference that points you this way?
    Better teaching structure? More material? More infield coaching/calibration?
    I'd like to do a MM bootcamp in the future. I'm in similar shoes to you.
    I haven't been to an RSD bootcamp and I've only attended Mystery Method's Special Bootcamp in Las Vegas, NV.
    The way they set up and executed that siminar was awesome. They gave detailed descriptions of the M3 model step by step. They provided many gambits and the building blocks for your DHV stories. Durring the siminar they would have exercises where you'd get set up in a small group (about 7 guys) with an Instructor and that instructor would help you with the material on a personal level. This small group was AWESOME and much like getting one on one advice. I do not know if future siminars will be structured this way but if so.. its definately worth attending. From the reviews I have read MM offers an insanely more structured method and more experienced instructors than RSD. MM instructors actually demonstrate sets and spend time insuring you understand not only the routines and layout, but also the theory behind why this stuff works so you can improve at home on your own.
    I've done my own research because I was genuinely interested in RSD and seeing whether or not a bootcamp from them would be worth the cost. After speaking with many attendees and sever guys who have taken both MM and RSD the consensus is MM is far superior.
    -Masters
       

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    RSD Bootcamp

    I attended an RSD bootcamp in London last September and it was absolutely shocking. No structure, no demonstrations from the so called experts just a waste of time and much needed money. They tell you to simply approach sets armed with no game plan, no material in the hope that this will "clear your fear". A load of rubbish. I had done a lot of work on my inner game prior to attending and felt pretty good but by 10pm on the first night, after being blown out countless times, I was back to square 1. Thats right, this bootcamp was counter productive to my game. They refused to give me a refund. DO NOT WASTE YOUR MONEY with these people!
       

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jota
    Looking back, if I would have known there was going to be little structure/material that first night I probably wouldn't have gone through with it.
    But being thrown overboard I had to sink or swim.
    I think marginal skill should be taught like you say. I don't get why this is lacking. Perhaps the workshop/seminar combo would be better for the rookie.
    I think you NEED the theory. The game is VERY linear. That's one of my problems with the SS videos. It is NOT linear at all (see my review) in fact they go out of their way to boast how not linear the presentation is. If I was a beginner and someone pushed me into set after after set the only thing I could see that helping is my approach anxiety. I cant imagine paying over 1,000 dollars and someone saying approach this approach that.
    Tell you what folks, you come to nyc and i will tell you who to approach for free (this is a joke obviously). If you are going to spend money on bettering your skillset I think MM is the only way to go. My game has grown by LEAPS AND BOUNDS. I cant wait to do attraction magic and hired guns i think these are some of the missing puzzles for me.
    View Full Profile: Click Here 200 + Reviews (Most In Company History): http://www.theattractionforums.com/t...iew_fader.html (watch my journey from student to approach coach, to instructor, to master instructor, to stripper destroyer).

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    If you've done an RSD bootcamp and were unsatisfied (and have proof of purchase and dissatisfaction) email info@lovesystems.com for the MM challenge. If you take a live MM program and do not feel that it was significantly better than RSD, we'll refund you completely.
       

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    Quote Originally Posted by Voo
    That's pretty crazy rivalry, the two companies must be really starting to compete against each other now.
    I think more interesting is the fact that Mystery Method has the BALLS to do that. As someone who took a seminar I can totally see why. That's really the thing folks, and it is what seperates the winners from the losers (the pua's, from the kj's, etc) talk vs action. I gurantee RSD is not offering a similar deal.
    View Full Profile: Click Here 200 + Reviews (Most In Company History): http://www.theattractionforums.com/t...iew_fader.html (watch my journey from student to approach coach, to instructor, to master instructor, to stripper destroyer).

    Best quote from a workshop review ever "Overall this bootcamp was a short colombian 10, his teaching ability is a 10, and his game is a 10."

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    Don't Be A Victim (click, read & change your life)

    play2win
    : There comes a point in everyone's life where they either have their dreams or the reasons they dont. You're the hero of your own story..... write a good one.

    Try Walking In My Shoes
    You'll Stumble In My Footsteps

       

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    Why would anyone say you're a newbie or have a weak frame for taking an RSD course? If you had a good time that's great. Your review looked good to me You included the good and the bad and you actually listed your instructors name. Thanks for writing the review.
    I can suggest taking a Mystery Method bootcamp and I can even suggest you'd be happier with the experience, however I don't think trying something is ever a bad thing unless everyone and their mom said the course sucked ass.
    -Masters
       

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    I've heard the weird RSD stories about RSD guys posting good reviews on sites and all kinds of weird shit. I don't know how much of that to believe, but I can attest to the fact that this review is written by someone not affiliated with RSD
    If you point your finger at me, I'll break it off
       

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rick
    Great review.
    I think if I ever do a boot camp I will do mystery's.
    Mystery is the pioneer on the field and I would think his guys are just as good.
    Hey Masters... does mystery go out on the field with students yet? does it cost more?
    Mystery doesn't do bootcamps very often anymore unless they're special.
    I'd suggest going with Sinn or Maximus instead though. They're better at teaching newer guys. I've heard guys say Mystery's sometimes too advanced to watch and learn from as easily as some of the other instructors. I don't mean to say hes not good at teach, its just harder to learn from the guy because he's incorporated so much into his personality and does so much without thinking.
       

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    Quote Originally Posted by Voo
    That's pretty crazy rivalry, the two companies must be really starting to compete against each other now.
    I would generally agree but Mystery is the original, the first, the best. Tyler and his crew, Badboy, everyone else learned from him. When no one was doing seminars and bootcamps, Mystery started the whole segment. (well, there were seminars before, but no bootcamps that I know of). I was hooked on RSD at first, around when I first joined, but after much reading I decided a long time agi that I needed the expertise of the people who deal with the master. People who still are on good terms with him and are not in competition but cooperation. I have so much optimism towards these guys and their product, so I am doing all that I can to get to SF in 2 weeks to begin my journey.
    fad3r, when did you take the bootcamp?
       

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaden Smooth
    fad3r, when did you take the bootcamp?
    Vegas. Doing hired guns and attraction magic end of april
    EDIT: And contary to what some might think I have nothing against RSD. I think Tyler is brilliant HOWEVER there have been NUMEROUS negative reveiws of their bootcamp. I dont think I have EVER read a negative review of MM
    Last edited by Fader; 03-2006-23 at 10:04 AM.
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    Best quote from a workshop review ever "Overall this bootcamp was a short colombian 10, his teaching ability is a 10, and his game is a 10."

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    real social dorks. they are out to RIP your money cause u suck as a whole and they brainwashed you like a piece of pork sticking in your left left index which you use to pick your nose.
       

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    Tyler Durden & RSD is a Scam? (This is one for the books folks)

    Thundercat has an "insider" who got a hold of some posts at their hidden RSD ( real social dynamics) forum..
    Anyways, has anyone taking their bootcamp? If so, how did it go....I have a friend who went to their bootcamp and tolled me the instructers are extremely LOW quality, however, he STILL didn't file a complaint. He just said, "they tooled me".....he is a very timid guy.
    You guys can read more about it here ===>> http://www.thundercatseductionlair.com/
       

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    Look at the comments he got before, he only starts back pedalling now. Obviously he has beef with RSD.
    TD is a great material source and is into a scam. But from what I know hes not at every sem? if thats so, I dont think the other pua instructors are anywhere near TD's caliber
    .whyldephaier.
       

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    600$ ???
    Dude, the RSD seminars are way more expensive than that.
    You're obviously talking about the RSD superconference. The superconference is NOT an in-field workshop. You just get to listen to Tyler and his exec coaches for 3 days.
    Interesting opportunity for the average community-fanboy, but not advisable for gaining in-field experience.
    How about using those 600$ for upgrading your wardrobe and spending some money on going out?
    Think about it.
       

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    Don't consider RSD for boot camps, from what I hear those guys are not up to par with MM instructers...hell, RSD is a rip off of MM.
    Here's what MYSTERY WROTE 15 minutes ago!!
    Mystery wrote:
    ">1. Lovedrop said you betrayed underscore, why was he so angry?
    Because he and Mystery had admitted a number of stundents into Mystery's lounge who paid for the privellege, thinking it WAS underscore, they then deceived them in order to keep the secret.
    Here's what REALLY happened. I was training new guys and wanted to let my students into Mystery's Lounge. Some current members were against it because they didnt want a "bunch of newbies" in. I told them that being personally trained by me (remember who in the community WAS already trained by me) would mean they'd be up to speed inside 6 months to contribute meaningfully back to the community. So there was so much upset that I got pissed that they would presume I was incapable of teaching others as I had them. So I thought, fuck that. Ill train up a NEW BATCH of PUAs. And guess what? It worked. I washed my hands of the OLD MYSTERY'S LOUNGE and they changed the name to UNDERSCORE. I then opened a NEW MYSTERY'S LOUNGE, transferred existing members to it if they chose to engage in discussions with guys who had just been through a bootcamp. What people THOUGHT would happen was a bunch of newbies would ask stupid questions and tank the integrity of posts. Instead what happened is we got all these new people who, after meeting me, became DEDICATED to this elegant artform. And now I have turned several former students into approach coaches and we have over a dozen bootcamps lined up from LA to NYC to Sydney Australia lined up in the next quarter. I just flew back yesterday from Lovedrop's bootcamp in Phoenix. I came in to surprise the boys (and handle the news interview there in the VIP section of E-4 where I made out with two girls inside 10 minutes (both of which I met the day before - one of which was GF material I feel) and get away for 3 days from my quality problems back here in Vegas.
    So UNDERSCORE became defunct. Mystery's Lounge is filled now with TRAINED PUAs, some of which now train OTHERS.
    Now, did my project work? magnificantly. Mystery's Lounge is password protected, security is tight, there's a great culture in there (less flaming when you have MET and sarged in real life) where LIKE MINDED INDIVIDUALS share challenges. Works for me.
    There was a matter of archiving the old Mystery's Lounge (which got archived and I think Lovedrop has it), and clearing it when the sign was taken down to be replaced with simply an underscore _. With no archive of posts it was like starting over. So some of the boys posted in both places for a while and underscore got smaller and smaller as Mystery's Lounge (the new improved one) got bigger and bigger (afterall, 10 bootcamps in a row make for a shitload of TRAINED PUAs who now a year and a half later have become solid. Ive personally seen improvements as I met with many students of past bootcamps. Again, some of them have become MM instructors. In fact, everyone in my company is a former student ... and GOOD PEOPLE.
    >Most of Mystery's clients are rich, so they can afford it, however Mystery has no answer to making them attractive so he says they've got to change their identity, thereby removing responsibillty for their success. His sick of the 'I'm an accountant' and just ducks the problem by saying its his student problem. His figured out what works for him, but hasn't figured out what will work for 90% of the people who go to his BCs, and yet are nothing like him.
    These comments make absolutely no sense to me. Day 3 of my seminar is all about identity building. I dont just say "Im Mystery and you arent". Its a full day of resolving the question, "Who am I." So forgive me for minimizing your comments to the "you have never even taken a bootcamp or met me" bin.
    >Now Neil's book.
    >Neil shagged TD girlfriend.
    No. He stole a set. VERY DIFFERENT. And TD got laid that night anyways (and I got a BJ the next day haa - good times in Vegas).
    >Neil shagged an 18 year old with 2 brothers at PH, not because of game but because he was revered.
    Bonus round. Just because a chick once in a while throws herself at you because you heated the set with a HOT APPROACH (aka: celeb game, which is different from the cold approach) doesnt mean the cold approach skillset all of a sudden vanishes. Be reasonable.
    >Neil artificially made himself the leader of men by demonstrating routines 'in the field' only, so when he walks into a bar the men are hanging on his every word.
    See thats the neat thing. What exactly is artificial about it? We would (just as I did again this weekend) show students how to run a set LIVE. Seriously, how fucking ballsy is that? And to get the girl again and again (dude, I have stories ... pictures ... video ... of the girls we met and shared ... time ... with ahem), then EXPLAIN how you did it is a fucking EDUCATION. If you are reading this and interested in knowing what others think of our operation click on the MM link on the home page and read some of the testimonials. These arent made up. They are written by guys like you whose only difference is, they TOOK a bootcamp and resolved many questions far beyond "is this for real?" Gentlemen, pickup CAN be learned. And its no secret it can be taught much faster LIVE than via text.
    >Also thundercat, your blug is fine, top quality, its just the posters who suck. Kill the stupid comments. Moderate it, set up a registry, whatever, just fucking DO IT NOW.
    agreed. I read your blog off my 6700 phone. having to scroll through repeat text crap, man. The blog is big enough and sophisticated enough to deserve a signup respect.
    >Thundercat censoring the excerpts, spinning them to show them in a worse light than they are.
    Look, I got an email sometime last year with a link to the RSD board. So I clicked on it and that was that. The password (which I dont remember for the life of me) was embedded. I started reading. And I was ... not "disgusted" ... more "yep, there they go at it again - clown shoes" to read what they were discussing with eachother. They were literally conspiring to fuck with people, namely Style at the time and it was all ... just wrong. Of couse being my good friend, I thought I'd step in ... but then my GF talked me out of it. Afterall, if I step in to protect a friend, I will go just a bit farther than anyone else. I think RSD, namely TD, knows this about me and so they seem to be staying out of my face. It must be my "when I go, Im taking you with me" mentality. And besides, despite all the crap and the misguided mesogynistic machiavellian thoughts that run through TDs head, he can PU. I personally put a lot of my time into that kid. And he's fun to watch. And he's got nuances that are good to add to your game. But a system of PU from TD? Sorry, that's mine. Learn MM structure then take all the other bootcamps, (Style's seminar on DVD is coming - I was there and it was very educational - they brought two girls back from the club and all of them took turned gaming them in the living room - I had my GF with me ... and at the end of the night walked the girl to the car and made out with her haa - I WIN), RSD boys are more frat boy mentality but hey, you'll get to see some PUAs run sets and PULL - always good stuff. Have a structure to put all you see into context though. You can get that structure from Chapter 3 of my ebook (which is free on my site).
    >Also where is lovedrop and Papa?
    I saw Lovedrop making out with a girl this weekend (I opened the set, obstacle1 liked me and he took her and converted to make out, I day2'd my target and made out with her, and he then made out with the other one on the day2 haa). Ive seen him pull girls. Now Papa? I havent seen him game in a LONG TIME ... well over a year and a half or more so what can I say? He is more into the business side and TD is more of the TALENT, but Papa has no problem fuckin' with ya in field and can approach ANYONE. Not too many day2s I hear, but thats not a slag, he's more focused on money than girls (which we all need to balance).
    >Thundercat, why are you doing this war? You are generating so much bad karma, WHY?
    Well, from what I had read of the RSD posts, the post thundercat showed u is just the tip of the iceburg. this is going to be a mounting multi-series of posts. I personally, having trained TD, had him crash on my futon in Toronto dozens of times, allowed him to a dozen bootcamps in exchange for helping me out at them, have had countless PU conversations, lived with him for months at PH, having shared a brief partnership seminar wise, and having seen him mack women LIVE a shitload of times ... so knowing how he thinks and then confirming it with the RSD plotting, I can tell you that they really do conspire and are enemy-centric (and the upcoming posts are damaging). Well just TD ... but he persuades all others (Papa is TD's yes man ... he was once mine so I know) so it wouldnt surprise me if he aligned with people who would easily share his dark perspectives. Are they good PUAs though? Shit yeah. Hang with TD long enough and it'll rub off on you ... with a few extra dark memes which make you even more loyal to him. We all knew TD for what he was and we accepted that at the time because he didnt lower out S&R value. but when he started to, we had disagreements. and STILL, disagreements aside, if I saw TD and the other RSD boys in field and he any of them were working a set Id wing them and help them get the girl. We are PUAs. All other shit aside, we're the fucking INFIELDERS. Hell I meet at least 2 to 3 guys a night who recognize me and come up to ask if Im Mystery and then have a picture taken with me. (Too bad only GUYS haa). Im sure TD is having that same fun. I know Style is.
    Now, is he banking on it? (Meaning, does he try to use his celeb to get the girl if possible?) fuck yeah. thats the whole point of playing HOT APPROACH GAME. I was interviewed on Playtoy TV a coulpe weeks ago. I had to drive all the fucking way to LA from Vegas and back for it. And guys trust me - it was fun to play hot approach from that. That was a good weekend for me. Is it cheating if a guy gets famous and uses his fame? are you kidding me? thats not cheating. thats THE GAME! Im about to make an ALBUM ... of love songs of course.
    OK, great hanging out with you guys as usual (ahhh gossip fodder) but I needs vittles.
    Love !Mystery"
       

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    Mystery isn't done typing.....here's what he wrote 8 minutes ago...If you guys don't know who Elvis is he probably has the Worlds recored for laying the most women in bed...he supposedly sleeps with 2-3 different women A DAY!...however, his method can't be thought because he is getting laid in a third World country like Dominican Republic and anyone who is American with a little bit of $$ can be getting laid more than any rock star in america.....anyways, here's what mystery says about him..
    Mystery wrote:
    >How is what Mystery does with "surivival and replication resources" much different from what Elvis does?
    I agree. Elvis has a specific game plan which only works in third world-like countries like the DR. (Ive been to Romania and believe his system would work there too - I think Rick H. played with this type of PU gambit and David D visited I believe). A recap, the basic concept is, as an American, move to the DR, and build a situation where your wing acts as your PA so you appear wealthy (and american). go in OFTEN (if you dont get the girl who cares there are more hot girls), go in DIRECT (off the street - saves time) and DHV up the freakin' wazoo so much so (The PA wing, the massive AI script from him, the car, the flash cash, the clothes) that she agrees to a date back at his house the next day which his PA sets up. Run around all day and by the end of the day youve got a steady stream of applicants. but it only works in the DR.
    I personally think the idea ... is fuckin' GREAT. Id LOVE to do that sometime. This gambit has little to do with COLD APPROACH but its a legit system if you want to do it. In MM, I suggest people move to target rich cities (scottsdale is THEE BEST) to improve their chances DRAMATICALLY. And Elvis suggests if you are American to move to the DR and play his game. Its not which is better, its simply what do you want. Chicken or Beef today.
    >Mystery can just afford American women, where Elvis couldn't (or so he has said).
    Haa, Im doing pretty good these days (search MM vs. RSD traffic to see how much better haa) but I STILL can't afford American Women.
    Love !Mystery
       

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    Quote Originally Posted by Remy LeBeau
    well, the RSD bootcamp is a bit cheaper than a MM bootcamp and i was actually considering taking it, being in my price range.
    im glad i found this article before i shelled out 600$.
    thanks for the post boys
    What's the difference between RSD and MM?
    The main difference I can see is RSD seems very much high-energy and more on the "be entertaining" frame than the "be interesting" frame of MM.
    Also, RSD seems to be totally based on going after young, party 5 nights a week type girls.
    I'm curious to the difference as I know RSD is the other major indirect school out there, and in their newsletters a lot of the stuff J-Laix talks about it seems like is the same as MM stuff.
       

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    Thundercat just got a cease-and-desist letter from RSD, that must mean something's up.
       

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    first i would like to say i do someday plan on taking a workshop and they aren't pointless. probably one of the more specialized courses. not that i have a terribly difficult time sarging but if i were to take the standard botcamp i want to do it more to meet instructors and visit a new place i have never been. personally i feel, at least for me and most of the wings i roll with, the basic 101 "how to" bootcamp can be discovered through months of practice although i am sure there are many things that are taught that even i haven't learned yet. this isn't the same for everone and a bootcamp will catch you up to spped or make you surpass many guys in a few weeks. i don't have too much social fear and i don't have a difficult time getting women. i believe from what i have read TD might have maybe might have more knowledge on why things work but Mystery and his crew instructs on how to make it work. what would you rather know why or how to make it happen? mystery has been in this a lot longer he might be more expensive but like almost all thing (except good mexican food) you get what you pay for.
       

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    Man, that material must be really incriminating for TD's lawyers to issue a cease and desist.
    I mean the most obvious of marketing strategies this community uses is to make people want the products more by making them apparently scarcer, "greyer" ethically, and more secretive (witness Style's lame-ass "Annihilation Method" marketing). The whole forbidden fruit theme, which is of course, a strategy they teach us for playing women...
    Surely TD is bright enough to know that by trying to force this stuff to be secret he is just going to make people want it even more. And then someone is going to "leak" it at some point... And then it will be an even bigger problem for him!
    Probably his best strategy would be to just negotiate with the big players (assuming it's not too late): Argue as follows: Do you really want people to consider that seduction instructors might be playing their own students? Let's just keep a lid on this: you will lose if this stuff gets out along with us.
       

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    There is more information on RSD and their business practices posted today along wth posts by Mystery.
    Highly suggest people read it but since it requires no registration it is like a tabloidal free for all. Stil there are VERY strong points made by both Mystery and Thundercat. You know what motivates people like RSD to pay lawyer's to draw up documents? Fear
    http://www.thundercatseductionlair.com/
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    Quote Originally Posted by No Bones
    Thundercat just got a cease-and-desist letter from RSD, that must mean something's up.
    Sorry guys but I've never heard of one of these before, what is a 'cease-and-desist' letter?
    When I am writing in red, it's as an Attraction Forums mod or admin. When I write in normal text, it's just me.




    And remember, if all else fails in set just try this, works everytime.
       

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stallion
    Sorry guys but I've never heard of one of these before, what is a 'cease-and-desist' letter?
    From Wikipedia:
    Cease-and-desist is a legal term meaning essentially stop: It is used in demands for a person or organization to permanently stop doing something (to cease and desist from doing it).
       

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    Thanks 'No Bones'
    From everything I've heard about RSD they do seem like a real scam, I don't see how they keep selling out bootcamps?
    When I am writing in red, it's as an Attraction Forums mod or admin. When I write in normal text, it's just me.




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    because they costs less then mystery but like i said earlier you get what you pay for. this does not apply to good mexican food usually the cheaper the better.
       

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    Funny how RSD get nothing but bad review's, not that many will stick up for RJ but MM is always going strong.
    I've not read anything bad about MM or it's bootcamps (not just here but anywhere)
    Guys like RJ and the RSD guys try too hard to make themselfs sound good where MM doesn't need to.
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    While you'd never hear about them on Thundercat's blog, I'd rarely see a positive RSD review elsewhere. Thundercat focused his attention on the growing negative reports from students, yet I assumed it was bias.
    Yet the RSD forum extracts TC posted online must have really struck a nerve for Papa and co. to send a cease-and-desist letter! Now I certainly know where my money will go in the future.
       

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    Without any bias I can state categorically: RSD is THE SUCK. Pushing people into sets & charging a thousand pounds for it? Funk that.
    You want to decent bootcamp you check out MM before any other. The only other bootcamp I could recommend woul be Juggler, he's a good guy.
    Mystery, Matador, Sinn, Lovedrop, Samurai et al... these are the guys that are going to SHOW YOU how to do this. They will involve you & you will understand.
    TD & Papa should have managed RSD better. He's a keen observer of humanity. I do respect some of the work he's put out there. The bootcamps are very low value for money.
    Listen to the guy... He talks so fast I can barely understand him & every fifth word seems to be, "right?" or "Yeah?" major validation seeking.
    Harlequin: Weapon of mass seduction
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    When you decide to change what you cannot accept: this is revolution.

       

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    Did anyone read the second pdf before he pulled it?
    View Full Profile: Click Here 200 + Reviews (Most In Company History): http://www.theattractionforums.com/t...iew_fader.html (watch my journey from student to approach coach, to instructor, to master instructor, to stripper destroyer).

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    Quote Originally Posted by fad3r
    Did anyone read the second pdf before he pulled it?
    Yes, I believe I actually have it saved at work because that's what firefox does with PDFs. It was nearly all the same text, with different highlights and comments. Nothing particularly damning, and I'm no RSD fan.
    Businesses everywhere have employees that talk about customers this way. These guys just aren't very bright about it.
    When I am writing in red, it's as an Attraction Forums mod or admin. When I write in normal text, it's just me.
       

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vapor
    Yes, I believe I actually have it saved at work because that's what firefox does with PDFs. It was nearly all the same text, with different highlights and comments. Nothing particularly damning, and I'm no RSD fan.
    Businesses everywhere have employees that talk about customers this way. These guys just aren't very bright about it.
    The second one was supposed to have more incrimiinating things in it.
    View Full Profile: Click Here 200 + Reviews (Most In Company History): http://www.theattractionforums.com/t...iew_fader.html (watch my journey from student to approach coach, to instructor, to master instructor, to stripper destroyer).

    Best quote from a workshop review ever "Overall this bootcamp was a short colombian 10, his teaching ability is a 10, and his game is a 10."

    My Bootcamp Schedule:
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    You'll Stumble In My Footsteps

       

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    Quote Originally Posted by fad3r
    The second one was supposed to have more incrimiinating things in it.
    Yeah, it didn't, though I didn't find the first one particularly incriminating either. A PUA should know better than to build something up and have nothing much there. It was mostly the same stuff, with different highlights and TC's interpretation of what it meant. Some of it was a bit of a stretch. The fact that he was clearly reaching in places weakened his argument.
    You'd have to be pretty dumb, given their feedback, to give your money to RSD. They almost certainly do try to manipulate students into writing good reviews (they have them write reviews with the instructor watching!). But there's nothing concrete in part I or II to support it.
    In fact, the C&D letter works in TC's favor, because now people will assuming something terribly damning was exposed and re-hidden, when it fact it was mostly RSD instructors acting like dorks who don't like their customers.
    When I am writing in red, it's as an Attraction Forums mod or admin. When I write in normal text, it's just me.
       

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vapor
    Yeah, it didn't, though I didn't find the first one particularly incriminating either. A PUA should know better than to build something up and have nothing much there. It was mostly the same stuff, with different highlights and TC's interpretation of what it meant. Some of it was a bit of a stretch. The fact that he was clearly reaching in places weakened his argument.
    You'd have to be pretty dumb, given their feedback, to give your money to RSD. They almost certainly do try to manipulate students into writing good reviews (they have them write reviews with the instructor watching!). But there's nothing concrete in part I or II to support it.
    In fact, the C&D letter works in TC's favor, because now people will assuming something terribly damning was exposed and re-hidden, when it fact it was mostly RSD instructors acting like dorks who don't like their customers.
    I dont know man. Mystery said some of the things were pretty damaging and there is no motive for him to talk shit. I am sure eventually it will all get leaked. We'll have to wait.
    One interesting thing I got out of the whole thing is that style is releasing a dvd set (did anyone else pick that up, if not you did now!)
    View Full Profile: Click Here 200 + Reviews (Most In Company History): http://www.theattractionforums.com/t...iew_fader.html (watch my journey from student to approach coach, to instructor, to master instructor, to stripper destroyer).

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    Quote Originally Posted by fad3r
    I dont know man. Mystery said some of the things were pretty damaging and there is no motive for him to talk shit. I am sure eventually it will all get leaked. We'll have to wait.
    They certainly looked like a bunch of tools compared to the MM staff. I didn't find the text incriminating because a) I already thought that, and b) it wasn't what they were being accused of. If I have the PDF I'll PM you (unless an RSD lawyer reads this, in which case I am just kidding )
    One interesting thing I got out of the whole thing is that style is releasing a dvd set (did anyone else pick that up, if not you did now!)
    I did! Pretty cool
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    Tyler Durden

    I find this guys extremely smart with his theories, but at the same time sleezy.
    He talks about how he is in teaching guys cause he loves when somebody thanks him for the help... It could be, but he dosnt sound sincere to me, I think he is more after the dollar bills.
    This isnt the first time we hear negative comments about RSD.
    And I think where is smoke there is fire.

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    From what I've heard about him, TC's got nerve calling other people frauds.
    If you point your finger at me, I'll break it off
       

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rain
    Let this miserable thread die. Who cares?
    On the contrary: I think that the way seduction artist apply their talents outside of the realm of picking up chicks: in particular in student and business management and in seduction marketing will make for some quite fascinating reading, some day...
       

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    Quote Originally Posted by PhilosopherKing
    On the contrary: I think that the way seduction artist apply their talents outside of the realm of picking up chicks: in particular in student and business management and in seduction marketing will make for some quite fascinating reading, some day...
    My point is that this thread is adding zero value to those looking to learn pick up. Which SHOULD be everyone on the board. Comments about RSD should go in the review forum.
    You want some business/seduction parallels? Check out about half of my threads. You'll find plenty of crossover information and analysis.
    Cheers.
       

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rain
    My point is that this thread is adding zero value to those looking to learn pick up.
    Again, I am going to have to disagree with you, here. I have found introspection about the times I have "been gamed" by others to be extremely valuable when it comes to studying PUA. This introspection gives you empathy as to why this influence stuff work and gives you a yardstick to measure how beta or alpha you are.
    For example I remember a demonstration at my bootcamp: We were sitting down having a coffee. An instructor, Future, asked me to take a cup away from him: I remember taking it away easily at first, but as soon as he offered some resistance, I just let go of the cup and let him have it back. "Gamed" in a harmless way. But what do you think the point of this exercise was? Do you think the exercise had zero value?
    I strongly suspect that other gPUAs might be a bit on the gullible/malleable side:
    They need concrete examples to know to what extent they can take what gurus say at face value. Being a bit more skeptical is a good thing: You learn you need to think for yourself, and FT the shit out of stuff. Good alpha qualities to develop won't you say?
    Now, finally, I do hear what you are saying: Should this thread be people's sole obsession? No. Are threads on what kind of clothes to wear and field reports, still important? Of course. But you are saying this thread has zero value: No way!
    Last edited by PhilosopherKing; 04-2006-21 at 06:19 AM.
       

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    Quote Originally Posted by Swinger555
    If you are considering taking a RSD bootcamp, I urge you to read this review first.
    Last November I signed up for a RSD bootcamp and I took the Feb 3-5 bootcamp in NYC. While I knew that it isn't a magic pill going into it, I was promised by TD personally over the phone that the bootcamp would be tailored to my individual needs, and would shave a minimum of one year off my game. On top of that, they claim these things on their website:
    "1- We take you out into malls, cafes, restaurants, and clubs to demonstrate how to meet women right in front of you.
    2- We act as your personal wingman and meet women together.
    3- We get you doing it step-by-step (what to say, the right body language, how to create sexual tension, everything.
    4- We work with you and give you the kind of potent and crucial feedback that you need to get this area mastered until you've got it sorted out.
    The program is structured so that even if you've never approached a woman in your entire life, you'll feel totally comfortable and at ease."
    Lies. All lies. They fulfill none of these things; it's just marketing hype to lure an unsuspecting individual into giving them his or her money.
    Before I took my bootcamp, I sent out multiple emails to my instructor and the coordinators stating what I'd like to do during my bootcamp, and what I'd like to accomplish. Because this was supposed to be a customized bootcamp, I requested the majority of the time to be spent in field, as well as adequate demonstration so I could see what "good" looks like, and have a role model to follow. When I brought these things up to my instructor upon meeting him, after he received my email and promised to fulfill my requests, he told me "We'll see." We'll see? Last I checked, I am the customer, am I not?
    I arrived at my bootcamp early in NY to meet my instructor. I was actually thrilled at who my instructor was, as I'd heard he lived for over a year in the Project Hollywood mansion with Mystery and his gang, so his game had to be top notch right? On top of that, it was a 2on1 bootcamp as opposed to a 4on2, meaning more sets, and more attention. Things were looking great. To all those who knew me beforehand, I was very much looking forward to this experience, and went into it with an open mind.
    Or so I thought... My instructor was actually nervous and a bit fidgety upon meeting him. Now I can understand nervousness is human, but it struck me as odd as this is supposed to be a guy who's a mPUA, and has conducted hundreds of workshops. I would soon find out that he is indeed a social robot, and lacks the ability to vibe on anything else besides game. There were many times where I, the other student, and my instructor would be walking down the street, in complete silence. I guess the term "Real Social Dynamics" is used very loosely.
    The first two days of the bootcamp ran from 7:00pm to 2:00am, and we'd spent from 7-11 in a boring seminar, where my instructor drudged on and on, preaching theory and material that I already knew, and can easily be researched via the asf archives (hence why I requested the majority to be field work, and was promised to me beforehand). We'd spent the other 2 and a half hours in a club, where my instructor pushed me into sets. Here's the thing though.. he refused to demonstrate any sets whatsoever. He flat out said no. In fact, during the course of the three days (21 hours) I witnessed him approach a total of four sets, only one that I could actually hear him in. I was highly upset by this as one of the main reasons I decided to take this bootcamp was to see how the masters do it live and up close. I now have second doubts about my instructors ability to perform, as I feel he was making excuses just so he didn't have to approach.
    As far as feedback went, here was the feedback I got after approaching sets at the end of the night. "Good job on approaching man, you did what 99% of asf can't do."
    That was it. No constructive feedback at all. In fact I was so upset with the way things were going, and the complete lack of caring by my instructor, that I actually left the program early one of those days, with no desire to continue. It was so bad, I was tempted to not even attend day three at all.
    Day 3 was a total joke. It ran from 11pm to 6pm. We spent the first five hours of that in another seminar, going over the exact same material we had gone over the first two days. The second hour we went shopping at various clothes stores so my instructor could show us what's currently in style. That was the magic makeover they promise. You can get this same experience watching the fashion channel. Finally, the last hour we spent in field. That's right, a mere one hour on Sunday was spent doing field work. Highly disappointing.
    After this complete waste of money, I emailed TylerDurden the following day, stating my concerns, giving him a chance to somewhat remedy the situation. His replies contained the context of "We have your money now, and there's nothing we're going to do for you." In fact, I didn't even want my money back. I would of liked a second bootcamp where things are done right. I even tried to negotiate for a single phone coaching session, where I could at least learn something. No deal. He even had my instructor call to confront me on why I thought the bootcamp was bad. Very disappointing, considering TD states claims that their customer service has gone up 1000% over the past two years.
    So if you like throwing money away, the RSD bootcamp may be for you. Before you consider spending that $1500, I would suggest giving yourself a makeover, donating that money to the homeless, or hell, put it in a brief case, go to the center of your city, open it, and let it blow away in the wind. The money will be better off, trust me.
    Hell, if you'd like, I can give you the exact same bootcamp experience for a mere $20.
    To sum up:
    Pros:
    -I got a new pair of jeans which cost me $283.
    Cons:
    -Over the course of three days (21 hours) we spent a mere 6 hours in field.
    -Over the course of three days, my instructor demonstrated a total of four sets and refused to do more, despite my numerous requests and pleads.
    -Seminar material was unoriginal, and can be found on these forums for free.
    -Complete lack of customer service.
    -Complete lack of caring about the students success.
    -The entire bootcamp experience.
    If you have any other questions regarding my experience, please don't hesitate to email me at sliek0722@aol.com. I am the fourth guy in my lair who has had a bad experience with RSD, and I will be the last. I'd like to make sure you guys make an informed decision before signing up with these guys.
    Swinger555
    You should also post here
    http://www.ripoffreport.com/
    your experience. It will be indexed in google.
    Make sure to spell it
    Realsocialdynamics not real social dynamics..
       

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    Tyler Durden Workshop Review Request

    I know there is a big controversy about the Real Social Dynamics team, but I really don't want to bring that here on the forum. I have no idea about the truth or about the details.
    I have listened to a few audios from Tyler and seen his appearances on David D' seminars and I have to say that I have really been impressed by the guy. He know what he wants and he doesn't apologize for his needs.
    So my question is : has someone here done a worshop with Tyler and went into the field with him ?
    Was it worth it ? I mean as good as the guy seems to be when he speaks on stage and explain his point of view and state of mind about seduction ?
    thanks for any input.
    Last edited by GameBoy; 08-2006-09 at 11:49 AM.
       

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    RSD Review London 7/7/06

    RSD review 7/7/06 London.
    Note: This is a long post. This is my first ever post and it’s starting with a RSD review and will contribute from now on. I’m writing this solely because I read a lot of negativity on these guys and want to express how my experience was with them.
    A little background on me first. I'm 24 and decent looking with good social skills around my friends but have always been scarred on women. Prior to ASF I’ve been laid only a few times and had fucked up inner game until I found this community.
    I've been in the game for over 6 months now (when I say 6months I mean going out in the field and not a KJ as I once was). I learnt a few routines, worked actively on internal state, BL etc and tried different techniques as I discovered them. I've even gone as far as finding new wingmen through P.A.I.R and now there’s a crew of us every week end in Birmingham hittin’ up the clubs (look us up guys if you’re in the area!)
    My game was so, so as I once thought and getting women was more hit and miss and had a few ONS throughout. Even though the guys I’ve met throughout this crazy journey, I was yet to still discover someone I could really learn from, model and wanted to see what good REALLY is.
    So I emptied out my piggy bank and signed up with RSD. Signing up with these guys was scary 'cos from what I recall RSD have had more negative reviews than all the other workshops and Thundercats blog rips the shit out of RSD all the fuckin' time.
    1st night.
    Met 1 of the instructors and 2 other students where Stuart (helping out instructor) briefed us on the weekend and talked about general game theory. We did some state building exercises (shouting LOUD in Starbucks. Talk about social pressure!!!) and he said that he weren’t gonna teach us any routines and just to approach tonight and do sets because that way, your not hiding behind any persona's, your gonna vibe and your being your NATURAL self which is the goal for all PUA's eventually.
    So I hit a bar/club with only the 2 students cos Stuart and Tux were meeting us in there later. So we arrive around 9.00pm to the club and just started doing AFC shit like standing around and drinking for about an hour.
    Stuart arrives with Tux quickly, find us and that’s when the real action began. We were pushed into sets hard. I was just free-styling what ever came out my mouth and tried to avoid routines just to see how long I could last, which surprisingly was long. I didn't even have time to think and just act which was cool. All I kept hearing was "It's all about the moment, there’s a set. Go in, RIGHT HERE RIGHT NOW, MEN OF ACTION, GO!!!" The other 2 students were hittin' sets left right and centre and one student was already making out with this HB8.5!!!
    Tux/Stuart winged us pretty well. These guys are fuckin' GOOD. Tux accomplish intro'd me into a set of 5 asian girls.
    Tux: "these are my good friends L1ndo, come say Hi"
    Me: So how long have you known Tux?
    HB8.5: about 2mins
    I'm thinking WTF, but plow through the set making the girls laugh. Tux does really well. His BL and attitude is chilled and laid back. He isolates the girl in set by creating this bubble with him and the girl and she's shooting IOS's at him. Next thing I know she's going off with him to a corner in like 5mins!!!
    O.k. I know what your thinking, that its not hard to isolate a girl and you’ve all done that but NOT ME. He taught me to always get to the next point, I finally understand isolation even within’ groups.
    Time flew buy fast when you’re always in set and deep conversation. I was high 5'ing everyone, winging with the instructors, students and having a kick ass time (although at one point I did try to hide away from these guys just to get a breath but Stuart found me fast and said, "your on Bootcamp mate, cum'on. Men of action" lol). The feeling I got was the instructors were there for you and if you had any questions just ask. He taught me basics I wanted to know, like how to do the Spin Manoeuvre from the start of a set and how to keep a strong frame.
    Lessons learnt from that night were that I was already good at attraction and so was the other guys. Its just that the RSD guys were like me but in a few years from now except through discipline and taking action consistently, they got good.
    Day2
    Jeez I didn’t realize the post was getting long so I’ll cut it short.
    We did day game on the street, social pressure exercises (shouting in the streets. Asking silly questions), sarging on trains, clothe shops etc. It's not hard when you know how.
    I approached a number of girls on top Topshop. 1 cute HB:lingerie I approached within’ the ladies underwear section talking about lingerie and if I recall correctly, touching her breasts, ass, waste in Public with people watching. She was loving it and I completely dominated the situation. I remember thinking of taking her in the changing rooms for a quickie but extracted to practice more game. Tux gestured getting her phone number but I wasn’t interested in that, but rather the skill. I remembered the creating a bubble belief system Tux taught the night before and its amazing what you can do in the moment with a girl.
    We ended up doing the seminar portion which Tux and Stuart which they articulated real well even though I knew most of it, but he got me thinking in a whole new direction and different level.
    In the night we hit Tiger, Tiger which was just CRAZY. Hundreds and hundreds of fit women. To be honest though, I only did a few sets BUT because I ran them sets looong, time flew by. This time there was only 4 of us (2 students and 2 instructors). 1 student pussyed out mainly I think 'cos he was a high status, wealthy business man who found it hard learning and taking orders from others. Oh well..Quick note...these are the kind of guys who normally write these bad reviews and come in Workshops with limiting beliefs and thinking within' 3 days RSD are gonna fix me with the magical pill and I don't need to work at this. Total Bullshit. This game takes time and energy. Forget about lines and concentrate on the reasons behind the tools they give you.
    Anyway I was really impressed with the instructors ‘cos firstly it was a pure 1 on 1. I was with Stuart, and Tux with the other student.
    Secondly they both ran demo sets as I stood there watching and hooked the sets well. Tux disappeared for a bit then came back with an Asian girl! (as you can tell by now, he likes asian HB's). I was impressed.
    I remember opening a 2 set which Stuart sat around watching me/observing as I held the group and as soon as the energy was dying down, he jumped in and boosted it up. There were no seats and he "Mystery style" stole her seat and got her on his lap, Awesome.
    After each set I did, he didn't hesitate to tell me were I was going wrong, what I could had done better but for the most part was impressed with my game so far in attracting girls, hooking them and kino.
    The high light of the night was I opened another moving set, isolated them (which I could never had done before consistently) and held it for the rest of the night. When I ran out of things to say I remember Tux saying "look, move past routines, you don't need them crutches no more, learn to vibe?. Stuart comes in set and wing me, and I watch his game and just learn and vibe with my girl. I was thinking of extracting the girls but to be honest, it was like 2.30am and I was knackered. Besides I wasn’t along to get sex was I? It was all about learning tools and concepts that were missing from my game and more practice.
    Day3
    We mainly talk about the structure of pickup. Each day they broke up the game plan, where day 1 was just approaching, holding sets, vibing etc. Day 2 we learned about opening, attraction, hook point etc, but in serious details and examples. Day 3 was about emotional, physical connection, KC closing phone game etc...all the good stuff which I realize now is my biggest sticking point...NOT CLOSING THE DEAL!!!
    We shared common stories, experiences and asked shit loads of questions. What was funny was that I was talking about a post Jlaix once wrote on ASF, when Tux realized on the table were we were sitting, it had "JLAIX WAS HERE" carved in the Leicester square Starbucks coffee table...HAHAH.
    It’s like everywhere I went in Leicester square; there was the presence of PUG’s.
    The biggest things I got out of the program was what I was looking for.
    - To see what good is
    - To move past my sticking point
    Most of the theory and routines can be found through TD’s archives, PUG’s video’s/ ebooks, FS101 so having a head start from the other students I really started to understand more on concepts of inner game, tools, frame control etc.
    I realized I was good as I am but there’s always room for improvement, your always evolving and if you just stick with this game and meet the best guys, your game goes up ten fold man QUICK. I'm beginning to understand PickUp is PickUp not matter what system you’re using, along as you have the basics down (tonality, sub communication). Tux taught me to move past the fallacy of which method is better, indirect/direct/routines/scripts and really just improve yourself which is what counts( but High Octane Material is awesome when used in the right moment  ).
    The other student on camp did a MM boot camp not long back and actually got more out of RSD than MM. As I recall him saying, the first night they were shown demo sets and there were 9 or 7students, between 3 instructors and allot of theory thrown at them. But with RSD on Saturday night it was 1 on 1 baby!
    I'm not dissing MM cos I think it's great but a little advanced for newbies but learning from my past, I’d rather experience the MM boot camp for myself before I started making harsh judgments and the level I’m feeling right now, the MM bootcamp would do wonders.
    To wrap this up, no matter where your game is right now, do a bootcamp 'cos you'll learn something always as long as you’re willing to shut up, listen and ACT. These guys will push you and push you and honestly wear you out by day3 which is what a bootcamps all about. Just plow through and get out of your comfort zone.
    Don't have stupid expectations though either that 3 days will get you fixed with women for life, because it's all about making mistakes, learning from them,…………………..making more mistake and moving past them with constant consistency of repetition.
    All in all, RSD were everything I expected and more and I honestly can’t think of anything negative to say except the guys were normally late in arriving to meet them but that was a travel logistic issue.
    Time to meet the real man Tyler Durden at the September seminar London, and move up to the next plateau then maybe Mystery.
    Peace.
       

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    Glad you had a good experience.
    Quick note...these are the kind of guys who normally write these bad reviews and come in Workshops with limiting beliefs and thinking within' 3 days RSD are gonna fix me with the magical pill and I don't need to work at this.
    Were that so, Other companies like MM, CA, and PU101 would also have lots of bad reviews. They don't. I don't have any first-hand experience with the RSD guys, I'm just pointing out that it can't just be quick fix complainers writing their bad reviews. Other reviewers have talked about being taught by instructors who refused to demo or getting drunk while teaching. Doesn't sound like sour grapes to me.
    On night one, were you getting feedback or was it mainly just getting pushed into set to deal with approach anxiety? Was there no lecture time? Just trying to flesh out what the bootcamp consists of.
    When I am writing in red, it's as an Attraction Forums mod or admin. When I write in normal text, it's just me.
       

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    all this criticisms on RSD.... too late coz I already paid for the July 28-30 bootcamp in Toronto. I thought RSD is as good as MM but all i see is negative reviews. But i'll post my experience after the bootcamp and see if its worth the money.
       

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vapor
    Glad you had a good experience.
    Were that so, Other companies like MM, CA, and PU101 would also have lots of bad reviews. They don't. I don't have any first-hand experience with the RSD guys, I'm just pointing out that it can't just be quick fix complainers writing their bad reviews. Other reviewers have talked about being taught by instructors who refused to demo or getting drunk while teaching. Doesn't sound like sour grapes to me.
    On night one, were you getting feedback or was it mainly just getting pushed into set to deal with approach anxiety? Was there no lecture time? Just trying to flesh out what the bootcamp consists of.
    I also find it interesting when someone comes here and his first post is talking about how good RSD is. It's not like someone who has been on this board for a while and has credabilitity posted it it is someone whose first post says it.
    Either way glad to hear you feel you got your money's worth.
    View Full Profile: Click Here 200 + Reviews (Most In Company History): http://www.theattractionforums.com/t...iew_fader.html (watch my journey from student to approach coach, to instructor, to master instructor, to stripper destroyer).

    Best quote from a workshop review ever "Overall this bootcamp was a short colombian 10, his teaching ability is a 10, and his game is a 10."

    My Bootcamp Schedule:
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    Don't Be A Victim (click, read & change your life)

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    : There comes a point in everyone's life where they either have their dreams or the reasons they dont. You're the hero of your own story..... write a good one.

    Try Walking In My Shoes
    You'll Stumble In My Footsteps

       

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    Quote Originally Posted by abyss
    all this criticisms on RSD.... too late coz I already paid for the July 28-30 bootcamp in Toronto. I thought RSD is as good as MM but all i see is negative reviews. But i'll post my experience after the bootcamp and see if its worth the money.
    I'll be at the Juggler one in Ann Arbor that weekend. Good luck, and post a review.
    When I am writing in red, it's as an Attraction Forums mod or admin. When I write in normal text, it's just me.
       

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vapor
    Glad you had a good experience.
    Were that so, Other companies like MM, CA, and PU101 would also have lots of bad reviews. They don't. I don't have any first-hand experience with the RSD guys, I'm just pointing out that it can't just be quick fix complainers writing their bad reviews. Other reviewers have talked about being taught by instructors who refused to demo or getting drunk while teaching. Doesn't sound like sour grapes to me.
    On night one, were you getting feedback or was it mainly just getting pushed into set to deal with approach anxiety? Was there no lecture time? Just trying to flesh out what the bootcamp consists of.
    I totally agree man. I was REAL HESITANT in doing the boot camp from all these negative reviews but my budget was low and I managed to scrape a few quid to do RSD since I know my game ain’t super tight but was just curious to really know first hand what RSD were like.
    I mean listening to TD and reading his posts, the guys got some serious outer/inner game. I’m thinking. if his teaching courses then it’s got to be good and there’s tons to learn. Like I stated in my review I wanted to see what good was and I got that, so for the next piece in my game I’m just gonna try and model that until I reach that level and then move on. Small chunck remember?
    On night one, there was a lecture time at the start of the night and when we were in the club, after each set I had questions and the instructors had answers. At the end we had briefings on how I did.
    I explained to them that I know you guys use state building tactics to pump up the students for good reasons because a friend of mine uses the same state building to boost his workers in sales. (they do door to door knocking and after the door being slammed in their faces a few time it does hurt your ego). I told them to just be real with me and tell me when I’m fucking up which is the way I learn. They explained that there cool with that but on some students they can’t be ruthless because it would just damage their internal state.
    As for the other guys who took RSD and felt ripped off, I do feel sorry for them and I’d be pissed aswell if that happened to me. I can’t comment on RSD instructors around the world, but the instructors Tux and Stuart, did an awesome job. RSD in London is good.
    Anyway hope that help and thanks for the links.
       

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    Hey does l1ndo 's post throw off anybody else's... this is a plant.. for RSD detector?
    Only says positive things about RSD. and no balance of what was bad or what could be improved...
    Has NEVER posted here before..
    Slams Mystery's workshop WITHOUT working with them on Mystery's forum...
    (which signals to me he has an agenda )
    than my favorite..
    So I emptied out my piggy bank and signed up with RSD. Signing up with these guys was scary 'cos from what I recall RSD have had more negative reviews than all the other workshops and Thundercats blog rips the shit out of RSD all the fuckin' time.
    BUT doesn't give reasons why he would go to where all the negative reviews are while other companies have NONE...
    Actually I prefer workshop reviews where I actually might learn something. Can't say l1ndo 's post did that.
    than even another thing that REALLY odd.
    This latest review isn't it's own topic... It's a reply to negative reviews...
    Last edited by dish; 07-2006-10 at 12:02 PM.
       

  62. #62
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    RSD London Bootcamp

    Quote Originally Posted by Vapor
    Glad you had a good experience.
    Were that so, Other companies like MM, CA, and PU101 would also have lots of bad reviews. They don't. I don't have any first-hand experience with the RSD guys, I'm just pointing out that it can't just be quick fix complainers writing their bad reviews. Other reviewers have talked about being taught by instructors who refused to demo or getting drunk while teaching. Doesn't sound like sour grapes to me.
    On night one, were you getting feedback or was it mainly just getting pushed into set to deal with approach anxiety? Was there no lecture time? Just trying to flesh out what the bootcamp consists of.
    I totally agree man. I was REAL HESITANT in doing the boot camp from all these negative reviews but my budget was low and I managed to scrape a few quid to do RSD since I know my game ain’t super tight but was just curious to really know first hand what RSD were like.
    I mean listening to TD and reading his posts, the guys got some serious outer/inner game. I’m thinking. if his teaching courses then it’s got to be good and there’s tons to learn. Like I stated in my review I wanted to see what good was and I got that, so for the next piece in my game I’m just gonna try and model that until I reach that level and then move on. Small chunck remember?
    On night one, there was a lecture time at the start of the night and when we were in the club, after each set I had questions and the instructors had answers. At the end we had briefings on how I did.
    I explained to them that I know you guys use state building tactics to pump up the students for good reasons because a friend of mine uses the same state building to boost his workers in sales. (they do door to door knocking and after the door being slammed in their faces a few time it does hurt your ego). I told them to just be real with me and tell me when I’m fucking up which is the way I learn. They explained that there cool with that but on some students they can’t be ruthless because it would just damage their internal state.
    As for the other guys who took RSD and felt ripped off, I do feel sorry for them and I’d be pissed aswell if that happened to me. I can’t comment on RSD instructors around the world, but the instructors Tux and Stuart, did an awesome job. RSD in London is good.
    Anyway hope that help and thanks for the links.
       

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    RSD Bootcamp London

    Quote Originally Posted by dish
    Hey does l1ndo 's post throw off anybody else's... this is a plant.. for RSD detector?
    Only says positive things about RSD. and no balance of what was bad or what could be improved...
    Has NEVER posted here before..
    Slams Mystery's workshop WITHOUT working with them on Mystery's forum...
    (which signals to me he has an agenda )
    Actually I prefer workshop reviews where I actually might learn something. Can't say l1ndo 's post did that.
    I understand where you’re coming from. Yes this is my first time I’ve posted and if I was reading the post I’d be cautious of it to. It’s only natural to feel that way but please understand this was my RSD EXPERIENCE on that weekend.
    This doesn’t mean that I’m calling everyone liars who had bad experiences with RSD, its just I found the boot camp really challenging and useful TO ME.
    On another note, I’m not slamming anyone. I believe MM workshop to be just as great and I’m looking forward to it when I sign up in a few months. I have his e-book, 5 DVD video course, secret sarging footage, audio and even the 2002 seminar where TD and Papa are there helping him coach a bootcamp. The guy had serious skills even back then before his M3 model.
    To me Mystery, Lovedrop, TD Badboy etc are all guys who are in the same boat. The Boat that gets LAID and you can learn from all of them by having an open mind.
       

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    This is funny

    OK this is so funny to me, and I'll tell you why. I know Lindo, although I never call him that. About 4 months back he was the first guy I met from the "seduction community". I basically messaged everyone from Birmingham, UK on P.A.I.R. and of the few guys that replied I met Lindo.
    Anyway, I've been sarging with the guy ever since. Now this guy knows more seduction material than anyone else I know. He literally has read, watched and re-read and re-watched everything out there. It used to make my mind boggle just thinking about it. Anyways, in terms of field experience he had a few months headstart and the guy was better than me and I used to wing him as a complete newbie. The guy is genuinely funny and entertaining and was not what I expected when I first met a APUA. I thought everyone would be really geeky and you could tell they needed help, but strangely he seemed normal.
    So anyway, he told me he was going on an RSD bootcamp this last weekend, which I was VERY skeptical about. I thought with all the bad reviews why would you want to. Bottom line was it was cheaper. So anyway I get a call from him on Friday saying the instructor hasn't turned up and I think, shit I hope he hasn't wasted his money. Didn't hear from him till Sunday when he had come back and yesterday he told me to come online and read his review.
    Now in terms of him being an RSD secret agent or something is really funny just because I know the guy. OK who am I? I'm am APUA. I've been going out in Birmingham for the last 4 months trying to improve my game. Although I haven't posted much on MM, you can check out my posts on Harlequin's Leeds based lair called CarpePM and on the Central England Lair run by Brainfreeze. To be honest, I haven't been on any bootcamp so I can't comment on how good it is. Speaking to L1ndo on the phone yesterday he obviously got a lot from it so fair play I say. I'm just looking forward to meeting him on Friday for our weekly sarge to see how good he has really got. If you want to join us then email me at cheeky666@yahoo.com and you are all welcome. As for which one is better I don't care. I just want to get better.
       

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    the RSD bootcamp was definetly money well spent. although i've never attend a MM bootcamp, i learned a lot from the RSD bootcamp. i had a one on one course with Todd from july 28-30, and just watching him demonstrate was worth the money.
    the reason there are so many bad reviews depends on the instructor. my instructor Todd was amazing at the game and i got a lot of respect for him. i guess other people who took the RSD bootcamp had a high expectation and were expecting the "magic pill". i had a great time hanging out with Todd and i would definetly do it again.
    although i learned a lot from RSD, i still wished there were more theories involved. i guess i can only find that out from the Mystery Method bootcamps.
       

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    Absolutely NOT recommended. I've winged with literally dozens of RSD students. They all had the same sticking points and none of them had game. Here's a formula for having your own RSD bootcamp:
    -- Learn jealous girlfriend opener
    -- Learn Best Friends test
    -- Learn Bad Ass kids story
    -- Learn "bratty little sister" and "puff girls" routines
    -- Find a couple other buying temperature routines on ASF and use them
    -- Learn the trust test
    -- Buy a pair of New Rock boots and other peacocky clothes
    -- Go out to a club for the next three nights and repeatedly perform the above routines in the order I wrote them down in. Mostly on two-sets. Repeat this 8-10 times before you blow yourself out of the venue
    -- save $1500
    If you're thinking about going to workshop, pretty much anything other than and RSD workshop is a good investment. The top two I'd say would be either MM or Pick-up 101. I understand badboy and the approach are also very good.
    Hope that helps,
    Genius
       

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    Thank you very much for the feedback. that helps a lot :-)
       

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    ya the review of TD's workshop on the lounge is elite, you're not allowed to post it afaik, it breaks NDA.
       

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    -- Learn Bad Ass kids story
    -- Learn "bratty little sister" and "puff girls" routines
    can u throw those shits up please?!
       

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    Please do and if you want to learn about Tyler Durden's teacher, David DeAngelo, go here to discuss him and his methods:
    http://daviddeangelo.proboards106.com/index.cgi
       

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    Check out this thread about RSD bootcamps,
    RSD bootcamp - A complete ripoff
    When I am writing in red, it's as an Attraction Forums mod or admin. When I write in normal text, it's just me.




    And remember, if all else fails in set just try this, works everytime.
       

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    Quote Originally Posted by Genius1
    Absolutely NOT recommended. I've winged with literally dozens of RSD students. They all had the same sticking points and none of them had game. Here's a formula for having your own RSD bootcamp:
    So, what were their sticking points? Why were you winging so many RSD students?
    May bullshit baffle brains.
       

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    These are businesses that rely primarily on word of mouth for their success stories. Hopefully constructive criticism and not just bitching, whether it's TD or Mystery or any of the other masters will improve and develop. The best teachers always learn from their students and don't read straight from the book. Just like high school. I can see the potential for some nasty competition in the not too distant future but hopefully we'll be on the same page levelling the playing field.
       

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    Recent RSD bootcamp?

    I don't mean to beat a deadhorse, guys. I'm still sitting the fence concerning a RSD bootcamp and was wondering if anyone on here has been to one recently they could comment about.
    They'll be in my area soon, I'd like to improve my game, the price is fits my current bugdet, but that doesn't mean I'll "settle" for anything.
       

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    Hey magicman. I've heard good things recently about RSD. I would suggest taking their seminar. I haven't taken it personally, so keep that in mind, but just from talks on the lounge + with other people.
       

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    It's a pity that people still can't think for themselves.
    ''The Game'' shaped most peoples' views and mindsets relating to ''the community''. Although it is not intentional, people have a hard time seeing people and events from a different light from that in which Neil Strauss presents them. Strauss is a clever man and a good writer, and good stories have more of an effect than most people realise. Simply through, perportedly, sharing Strauss' experience and journey readers relate to him and readily take on his views.
    Strauss is the best PUA, why? Becase he said so. What proof? Thundercat's rating as best PUA. Is Thundercat neutral? No, he is an employee of Strauss. Does it matter? No, because people already relate to, and symethise with, Strauss.
    If we judge the respective men on their merits, TD has undeniably produced a larger volume of more helpful and profound work. He has come up with more methods and theories than Strauss, and he has been more honest. Strauss' annhilation method was literally ASF doctrine tidied up, made more trivial, and put into a well-produced video. And does Strauss actually have any better-than-average posts, even in his ML archive? Not in my opinion.
    The Blueprint is a masterpiece, and i judge TD on his work and respect him in accordance with the quality of his work.
    People buy into the mindsets of those who they idealize. In my opinion, many community members have bought into worse social-conditioning than they had before they found the community.
    RSD is a good company, MM is a good company, Badboy's company is good, PU101 is good, and they have all added something to the community, and they all have bad reviews as well as good ones. Only RSDs bad reviews recieve such attention, and this is because people naturally look for evidence to support the views they obtained from ''The Game'' and the virgin ''Thundercat's lair''.
    Appearing confident is not about expressing confidence.
    It is about confidently expressing everything.
    - Wayne Elise
       

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    does anybody else get the feeling this last post is a little bit off
    He's already said he highly affiliated with RSD because he's reviewing the blueprint BEFORE it's out.
    hmmmmm??
    Last edited by dish; 09-2006-05 at 02:07 PM.
       

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    RSD - Foundations

    A friend/wing brought this dvd set over yesterday. I probably only was tuned in and focused on this for about 60 percent of the program however I found it to be a great comprehensive explanation of game. If you have anything loose ends or piece to the puzzle that you want clarification on I think you will be happy with the program. It also gives you the basic skeleton here. There is not much for breakthrough material here, so if you are familiar with Tyler's role playing and cold reading skills and you are familiar with the Mystery Method you won't find much to add to your tricks.
    What you will find is a couple solid dvd's on tight inner game. You will also find a lot of expansion on comebacks and other area's of the game like qualification. If you feel a craving for some expansion and find Tyler to be someone that helps you to understand the game on a deep level as some do, you won't be disappointed.
    If your looking for him to whip out some new trick, bend or spin that is going to give you a new angel and put you over the top you may be disappointed. When it comes down to it this program is great for having a solid foundation and understanding of the game from open to close and the inner mentality it takes to make it work. Any confusion I still had was resolved.
       

  79. #79
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    RSD Superconference

    I would love to hear a great review of RSD's new superconference material - Both the DVDs and audio CDs
    -GameBoy
    All your women are belong to me.

    I hear their periods attract bears... bears can smell the menstration. - Brick Tamlin
    Check out GameBoy's Game Theory: Archive and Journal - updated 12/24/06: Songs I love to dance to.
    And check out GameBoy's new Blog: Devoted to all aspects of personal Style. (Including fashion)
       

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    I have watched the dvd program. I think the MM dvd's are much better for technique. The Rsd dvd's seem to be a deeper explanation of pickup however. If you are already gaming girls and getting laid on a regular basis then you don't need these.
       

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    RSD - Foundations

    This is not a very good product. I have only seen it once maybe if I check it out again I will get more out of it. I do like alot of what Owen Cook has to say about Game. Hope he will put something out better in the future.
       

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    Review of Tyler Durden Honolulu Bootcamp

    guys,
    people have been asking me to post my mystery's lounge review of the RSD bootcamp here on mystery's forum. Here it is in its full glory!
    Peace
    Big O
    ---
    Skeezo and I met up with TD at the W hotel lobby thursday night.
    If you read about TD in The Game, you would expect his seminar to be along the lines of, "Ok, first, you neg, then you peg, then you segue, blah blah" but to my shock it was to be nothing like that at all.
    TD told us that years ago, when he learned that Style would be writing a book on the game, he got together with his RSD instructors and told them that eventually, people would get wise to opinion openers and routines, etc. He didn't want people to be asking him "Are you one of those pickup guys?" etc. So he resolved to create a pickup style that would require no routines, no canned opinion openers. Last night he set about introducing us to this new style of pickup.
    He said that naturals get laid all the time. Are PUAs any less cool than those guys? No. So PUAs should not need to do anything that naturals don't do.
    he talked about a few things:
    * Separating the way you regard a person from the value they bring to the interaction. A hot girl brings all kinds of value: potential sex, validation, etc. You have to separate that value from the fact that she is a human being too, and see her as a human being without being affected by the value she is bringing to the table. Imagine that all of her value is in a pile between you two and you're looking at her not at the pile of value.
    * Not stepping up to her standard but instead setting your own more powerful standard and getting her to live up to it. You do this by being unreactive and getting her to react to you. You make bold statements, create a vacuum in the conversation by not saying anything afterward, and by doing so, pressure her into filling the gaps and thereby investing in the conversation and jumping into your frame.
    * You can't ever come across as seeking any kind of reaction from her; if you do, she knows that she can control your reality by the way she responds to you, and she will lose interest.
    * Get out of the mindset of thinking of what to say next before the chick even finishes talking. That is by nature reaction seeking. This is an important, but subtle piece.
    It sounds simple, and I think you've all heard some variation of the above before, but he had an interesting way of forcing us to see the light.
    He told us that we were not to use ANY canned material or openers tonight. We should not say anything that we didn't feel like saying. If this advice were coming from anyone other than TD, I would have been tempted to reach over and pull on his face to make sure it wasn't [name censored] hiding behind a mask.
    The point of this exercise was to teach us to subcommunicate our coolness rather than hide behind routines. Also, we need to see how easy it is to hook sets without using any magic openers or canned material.
    TD's girlfriend Roxana showed up in time to get dinner. She is hot. Way freakin hotter than Lance Mason's girlfriend, or Steve P's girlfriend, You-are-so-in-my-way-Will's girlfriend, Chet Rowland's girlfriend, Brian-of-dyd-interview-fame's girlfriend, and on, and on. She definitely has a better body than style's girlfriend.
    We went to Ocean's and ordered pupus for dinner. Roxana sent me into a 3 set seated at the bar. I was not allowed to use opinion openers, so I just went in Big O style, and of course it worked. I stole one of the girls' chairs and I really wanted to use canned material but instead I forced myself to improvise some bullshit about a conversation that came up at work that day ("How come I can't find fresh young coconuts in hawaii?") they were loving it. Roxana came up and pulled me out of the set. I thought I had done something wrong but she was just checking on me.
    After we finished our food, TD brought me back to that same set. He opened with something about animal sounds. He started mooing at the girls. At first they were like WTF? but he held his ground. He didn't care what their reaction was. It didn't affect him either way. He was drilling into them with his eye contact and presence. They cracked and he started getting IOIs from both of the girls; they started asking him questions and feeding him their fries.
    I was astounded. I mean, I've always heard it said that you can open with anything and it will work, but I've always thought that meant "anything will work *some* of the time, it's just hit or miss, and you need hi tech openers to get it to work consistently"
    TD talked about watching naturals fuck up all the time, have shitty comebacks to shit tests, but because their subcommunication was good, it didn't matter. He said that if he made the same fuck ups, he would have ejected or would have lost state, but his natural friends were totally unaffected. That is how you have to be. By using these shitty openers and just holding our ground and not losing state when we don't get a warm reception, we are cultivating this ability to be nonreactive.
    I learned that my subcommunication is really great. I can open with just about anything. Here are some of the wacked out openers I was forced to use by TD. Keep in mind, every single set hooked.
    Animal sounds -- cow, monkey. This worked great on the hotter sets but ug sets thought we were calling them cows.
    "I like salad." Dude man, if you subcommunicate this right, girls just step into your frame with shit like, "ooh. I like tossing salad!"
    "so how's your night going?"
    "hey, what are you guys drinking."
    "where did you get those earrings."
    TD was really impressed with my game. He was suspicious that I was using canned material to be getting the kinds of responses I was getting but I wasn't. I was just riffing. it was one of the most insane, enlightening, mindfuck experiences of my life: realizing that no shit, I'm cool enough to get attraction from girls just by being myself, as long as I don't look like I'm seeking a reaction from them or want anything from them.
    this is the trap of routines: we design them to get a reaction, and this sets us up to expect a positive reaction from the girls when we use them, so when they don't work as planned, we are at a loss, and it throws us off. either we don't know what to do and we eject or we feel like shit because our routine tanked and the girls detect how we feel and lose interest.
    keep in mind these girls I was opening were among the hottest girls I've opened since coming to hawaii. in fact the hotter the girls, the better they responded to this new style of game. I was getting mad IOIs: girls were sniffing my armpits and saying I smelled like "abercrombie," pinching my nipples, bumping into me on 'accident' it was retarded. it made me realize what portion of my results were from routines and what portion was just from how I was carrying myself and subcommunicating.
    Here is a sample interaction:
    [Skeezo opens a two set, I go toward one of the girls to isolate]
    Big O: I like salad.
    Girl: oh, is this the topic of the night, you guys are just going around hitting on girls by asking them about this
    Big O: Oh that's so cute she thinks we're hitting on her. Actually, before I hit on you, you're going to have to tell me three things about yourself that will make me want to get to know you better.
    Girl: Well, I blah blah blah. I like yellow, but only bright yellow. [I'm wearing a bright yellow shirt] and blah blah blah.
    Big O: Ok, cool, I'll start hitting on you now. Is it ok if I don't have a lame pick up line.
    Girl: Yes. That was incredible how you defused that awkward moment
    Big O: [I start quickly hitting her arm, 'hitting on her'. Girl gets it and laughs]
    [I pull her out of her seat, spin her around, sit down, and pull her between my legs. game over. she starts asking me all kinds of questions. we see who has the nicer ass. she definitely did. skeezo's girl keeps suggesting that they go to the dance floor and eventually they do. later that night, this girl totally 'bumps' into me on the dance floor. she made damn sure I felt her whole package. ]
    Keep in mind, TD's only goal for the night was to get us to do this wacked out shit and make sure there was no difference in our heart rate before and after. Lo and behold, after that first set, there was no difference. Let me tell you guys that last night was the smoothest game I have ever run, and I didn't have to use routines. I didn't feel like I was working hard to get attraction, I wasn't plowing. It was the easiest, most natural thing. In the words of badboy, it was like taking a shit.
    I was just so taken aback by how well everything was going that I would just keep chatting and not advance the sarge. So at the end of the night I started forcing myself to qualify, and close. Tyler commanded me to turn around and open whatever happened to be there with a compliment. it was a cute korean girl standing by herself. luckily she had big heart shaped earrings. I opened with "ooh, where did you get those earrings?" at first her expression darkened for a moment, but when she saw that I was unfazed by her display, she brightened up and answered my question. it was on from that point forward. I #closed. The next day, TD tells
    me that the girl had a boyfriend; he saw them making out as we left the club.
    at the end of the night, TD told me that I needed to be more alpha, do more shit like moving girls around, getting in their faces, caveman, etc. He said I needed to cut down on hand gestures, not to gesture with my hands as much, as it is somewhat girly.
    All in all last night was an amazing experience. We weren't thinking about 'club value' or silly 'wing rules'. TD and I would sometimes walk up to a seated set together and open, which is supposed to be a huge no no. We didn't feel the need to do magic tricks or mind reads.
    I no longer think that 'fake it till you make it' is the best route to success. There is a place for routines, but you need to know what it's like not to use them, not to use high-tech openers, and just be chill, relaxed and unreactive. Then, when you start busting out with routines, damn. it will be smooth.
    --------------
    The second night we were at the W. I opened a two set of girls and it hooked. TD comes in, turns to my target and shouts "I will fuck you up." The girl says "how?" to which he responds, "Ways you can't even imagine." The obstacle drags the girl away. I'm thinking, "Shit, I just got blown out by TD," when suddenly, a bouncer comes over and asks TD to come with him. The girl must have complained about TD to the bouncer. TD brings his girlfriend and follows the bouncer.
    As it turns out, the bouncer is the target's BROTHER. Any other dude would have gotten kicked out of the club, but TD manages to convince the bouncer that his sister is lying, then he games the sister and makes her love him, all within 10 minutes.
    In response to the girl's accusations, all TD said was, "Dude, I'm stone sober." The bouncer said, "So are you saying she's lying?" "I'm not saying anyone's lying. I just didn't say those things." The girl starts to rage and whine. She looks really bad. TD is totally unreactive. Then TD does something to game up the girl and she jumps into his arms and sayssomething like "I like you, you're cool. I'm sorry I said those things about you, that was stupid." And the bouncer lets him go.
    TD sends me into a two set of girls. I open my target by tapping her on the shoulder and smiling and her friend thinks that we already know each other. I start gaming her up and she can't stop laughing. I include the friend and now they both can't stop laughing. I bring them over to TD and Roxanne and introduce them. TD pulls skeezo into the set and I start talking to the target. Target's bf walks up so I grab the obstacle and isolate her and #close. thanks skeezo!
    TD says that isolating the target is a very "MM" thing to do. Whodathunk. HE doesn't even bother isolating. He just goes up to the target, attracts, force qualifies, and then #closes. He gets like 10 numbers a night this way and like 30% of them bite afterward.
    The second night ended up being much like the first. TD tells me afterwards that my game is "super smooth," that he can't believe I'm spending time on anything else in my life, and that if I want to start getting laid from cold approaches I just need to keep doing what I'm doing, and that it will happen once, then twice, then every week, and then pretty much every day. Ijust need to be more "aggressive and dominant." cool. but was this worth $2000 ??? I would find out for sure on the third night.
    --------------
    By the third night of staying up till 3am, my voice was shot to hell. I opened two sets with Roxanne but they totally tanked. Not because of my voice, interestingly: the girls in my set just can't stop staring at Roxanne. They keep wanting to talk to her and they can't understand why I would want to talk to them. haha. what a paradox.
    The rest of the night TD was on my ass making me do the most fucked up crazy ass ninja shit. He made me go into a seated set in the corner with 2 guys and 1 girl and no place to sit and open with "Hey, how's your guys' night going?" TD came in after I opened and we actually got major attraction from the girl in the set.
    He made me take off my shirt, and just go up to sets of girls and stare at them. Oh man, I thought. Not here, not at the W. At one point, I felt like I was going to throw up. TD pulled me aside and said, "Oh.. sorry man, you must be caring. You need to stop caring for this to work."
    Let me tell you guys, once you stop caring, going out and "sarging" (or "being social") just becomes 100% fun. You don't care if you get blown out, but you still get the rush when things go well. It's the only way to be, really.
    He made me go straight up to the fat chick in a group, grab her, and open with "I love you!" The whole time my face was within 2-6 inches of hers. She was ready to bang me. There is merit to ignoring the group and dealing with the obstacles as they arrive.
    He sends me into a mixed two set where the dude is this HUUUUGE, CUT SAMOAN dude. I'm like "uhhh.... are you sure?" and he's like "Don't worry man, I've got your back. I'm tyler FUCKING durden!" By the end of the set the dude was shaking my hand and shit.
    Another time he makes me open a girl and ignore her friends. When the cockblock comes by to take her friend to the bathroom, I do as TD instructed: I grab the cockblock and opinion open her. I hit her with my tightest stacking and fractionation. She is totally sucked in. My target sees what I am doing and goes DDB on me and is like, "what's your name??" I must have looked like the most socially skilled dude she ever met. too bad she had a boyfriend.
    So later TD and I are talking and he tells me to go open the set behind me. He says, "don't be afraid to look!" so I look and the girl sees me checking her out. TD sarcastically says, "Uh oh, not only is she with some guy, but you have been hovering next to her, and now she just saw you look at her. Now go open."
    I walk up and tap her on the shoulder. She's a beautiful, beautiful hapa girl.
    Big O: I like salad.
    hapa girl: [smiles] I think that's amazing!
    amog: I've heard that line before.
    Big O: [ignoring amog] I especially like caesar salad...
    inexplicably, TD pulls me away from the set. I think he is purposely trying to disorient me. I reopen the set that went to the bathroom, TD laughs watching me AMOG a dude in that set and pulls me away yet again. Now I'm standing in the hall talking to him and the beautiful hapa girl from the last set stands up.
    Hapa girl: "Come here! I want to talk to you."
    TD: [grabs me firmly by the shoulder] No, you can't have him!
    Big O: [to TD] what is that girl up to?
    TD: I have no idea.
    I starting dancing to the music, knowing full well this bitch is watching.
    Hapa girl: Come here! I think you're hot!
    TD: No, you can't talk to him.
    I will forever be haunted by the beautiful hapa girl. Why did TD grab me and keep me from talking to her? I never saw her again that night. She could have been my girlfriend.
    TD told me that if I want to pull 10s from the club, I have to be super aggressive and dominant, totally unpredictable and uncontrollable. I have to be fucking posessed by satan. For some reason that last line really resonates with me.
    I ran the most high energy game I've ever run in my life. I wasn't possessed by satan, but perhaps a lesser devil. At one point, TD just grabs some girl walking by and says, "I don't believe you've met my friend." I grab her and the whole time I keep her off balance with a combination of gibberish, dominant kino, and improvised bullshit. Near the end of the sarge, I picked her up and moved her across the hall. I grabbed her and taught her some new dance moves. This girl has a boyfriend who is like captain of the honolulu jiu jitsu academy but I still got her number. On her way out with her hulking bf she turned and gave me a smile I will never forget.
    Another way of looking at it is this: the way all of us have been gaming up to now betrays an underlying sense that we don't deserve hot girls. The way we've been running game, it's more like, if we open them and they walk off, it's a confirmation of our underlying belief that our "game" isn't good enough and therefore we are unworthy of that set. If we did believe we deserved them, we wouldn't be afraid to do things like grab girls who keep walking after you open them and pull them in closer.
    We need to believe to our very cores that fucking hot girls is our manifest destiny, a given, a fait accompli. Until then, we are just spitting routines from a safe distance, bodies angled away from the group so if they don't hook immediately we can turn away and protect ourselves like the pussies we're acting like and hence are.
    TD looks at it like this. In Homer's age, women were like cattle. Do you think Odysseus ever thought for a second that a woman was more worthy than he? That's the way we should think about women. The fact that today women are allowed to run around all dressed up inside of a club should not make a difference.
    Big O
    "A girl is like a hockey puck."
    -- Tyler Durden
    Last edited by olozanthes; 10-2006-13 at 07:15 PM. Reason: to remove my friend's true name from the post
       

  83. #83
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    So far I have only really gained from the small segment on congruence tests (essentially frame control which one can never get enough of).
    And changing women;s minds when they say no.
    I have now completed the series. I stand by what i said above. This series is VERY basic. If I were a n00b I might pay up to 30 dollars (one nights cover at a club in nyc with no list). The series is good because it gives like a 40,000 foot view of the whole dating process. I mean like really high up (which what can you expect for 8 hours)? On a side note Tyler lies on the disk which ruins his credability a little bit. He claims he can get 180 numbers a month and 15 numbers a night while out on bootacmps (bootcamps are 4 hours so that works out to 4 numbers an hour which is a number every 15 minutes and if he takes say 25 minutes for one he now has 5 minutes to get the next one ). Not sure why you would try to qualify yourself like this to students who have already paid for your instruction. I think this is a horrible exgaeration.
    On a positive note the 8th disk is MONEY. It's on identity and it is simply some of the best shit i have ever heard. I was definitely feeling it and learned from it. I already have a strong identity but there is no doubt that when Tyler is on he is on.
    Overall, I would stay away from this probably because there are better investments of money (I think it retails for like 380???).
    View Full Profile: Click Here 200 + Reviews (Most In Company History): http://www.theattractionforums.com/t...iew_fader.html (watch my journey from student to approach coach, to instructor, to master instructor, to stripper destroyer).

    Best quote from a workshop review ever "Overall this bootcamp was a short colombian 10, his teaching ability is a 10, and his game is a 10."

    My Bootcamp Schedule:
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  84. #84
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    RSD Foundations DVD course -- a must have!

    I recently took the RSD bootcamp. You can find my review of it on that site. I thought the bootcamp was amazing, but I couldn't help but feel like I had only gotten a small slice of the seduction knowledge Tyler D. had locked within his brain.
    So naturally, when the Foundations DVD course came out, I jumped on it. I'm pretty skeptical of Seduction DVDs because they are generally very boring and dry, but Tyler definitely delivers the goods.
    Even if, like me, you think you've seen it all, just listening to the way Tyler frames important concepts with jostle your worldview and ultimately make it stronger.
    There's another reason this product is so inspirational. If you've seen Tyler on David D's products, you might remember him as the scrawny, pasty guy with the Metro hairdo. He now sports long hair, a deeper voice, and bristling muscles. Man, if that guy can do it, so can I.
    I'll post more on this later when I get back.
       

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    So, overall, would you say it's worth $370 if you already own the Mystery DVD set?
       

  86. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by olozanthes View Post
    He now sports long hair, a deeper voice, and bristling muscles. Man, if that guy can do it, so can I.
    I'll post more on this later when I get back.
    I watched this and wasn't impressed.It's far too basic.
    As for tylers muscles....What are you on about??? He's a fat pale guy, in a t-shirt thats far too small for him.
    I don't like his delivery on examples either, his tonality seems agressive and seems to be wrapped in smarm with not a hint of charm.
    While I don't doubt his knowledge on the world of pick-up, I really do find it hard to believe that hot girls would fuck this guy.
       

  87. #87
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    thats a great report. the whole "being unreactive" thing hits home - i'd never thought of it that way before.
    yes, just about every solid night out has that as a feature.
    thanks a lot for the review, Big O,
    Sting
       

  88. #88
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    In what ways are the MM techniques better?
       

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    Just a note of caution to anyone who might order the Foundations DVD set, and decide to take advantage of their 30 day money back offer:
    I bought the DVD's, watched them for a week, and decided they were not worth the cost, so I sent them back via overnight mail - they got the DVD's back within 7 days of when I received them.
    It has been almost 7 weeks now, I have yet to receive my refund, and they're giving me the run-around about when it's going to come. Every time I email them, they give me a new excuse as to when the refund will come - first it was "the beginning of the month", then it was "any day now", then it was "in the next 5-10 business days"
    buyer beware, i'll never do business w/ RSD again.
       

  90. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by fad3r View Post
    On a side note Tyler lies on the disk which ruins his credability a little bit. He claims he can get 180 numbers a month and 15 numbers a night while out on bootacmps (bootcamps are 4 hours so that works out to 4 numbers an hour which is a number every 15 minutes and if he takes say 25 minutes for one he now has 5 minutes to get the next one ). Not sure why you would try to qualify yourself like this to students who have already paid for your instruction. I think this is a horrible exgaeration.
    25 minutes = a solid, nonflakey number.
    He didnt claim he can get 15 solid numbers he just said he can get 15 numbers if he so chose. Numbers a real fucking easy to get. 15 in 4 hours is a very doable number in a packed club.
    You should know how easy numbers are to get if youve been out in the field and just tried. Its getting them to pick up and go on a day2 after a 5 minute number that doesnt work.
    May bullshit baffle brains.
       

  91. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by Levo View Post
    25 minutes = a solid, nonflakey number.
    He didnt claim he can get 15 solid numbers he just said he can get 15 numbers if he so chose. Numbers a real fucking easy to get. 15 in 4 hours is a very doable number in a packed club.
    If you are ignoring your students....
    When I am writing in red, it's as an Attraction Forums mod or admin. When I write in normal text, it's just me.
       

  92. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Levo View Post
    25 minutes = a solid, nonflakey number.
    He didnt claim he can get 15 solid numbers he just said he can get 15 numbers if he so chose. Numbers a real fucking easy to get. 15 in 4 hours is a very doable number in a packed club.
    You should know how easy numbers are to get if youve been out in the field and just tried. Its getting them to pick up and go on a day2 after a 5 minute number that doesnt work.
    Cool man. Come to nyc if you can pull 45 numbers in 12 hours of partying of 8's and above I will pay for all your drinks, covers and meals. In fact we'll take pictures of each girl and let the forum decide if they are 8 and above
    Let me know if you are willing to take that challenge.
    View Full Profile: Click Here 200 + Reviews (Most In Company History): http://www.theattractionforums.com/t...iew_fader.html (watch my journey from student to approach coach, to instructor, to master instructor, to stripper destroyer).

    Best quote from a workshop review ever "Overall this bootcamp was a short colombian 10, his teaching ability is a 10, and his game is a 10."

    My Bootcamp Schedule:
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    play2win
    : There comes a point in everyone's life where they either have their dreams or the reasons they dont. You're the hero of your own story..... write a good one.

    Try Walking In My Shoes
    You'll Stumble In My Footsteps

       

  93. #93
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    I have no idea who gives the best Workshop. But what I do know is that I am completely sick of using routines and canned material. The old RSD game was more or less a MM copy. The new one based around non-reactivness and no canned material I like a whole lot better. So if I would take a workshop now I would go with RSD since they suit my style of pickup better.
       

  94. #94
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    To those who raised doubts about my impartiality: i am not, in any way, affiliated with RSD. I have no buisiness interests in the community, and i never have. As to the comment about my reading of 'The Blueprint'... well, how i read it does not matter;the version i read was, in my objective opinion, the best explanation of male-female social dynamics produced by this community.

    October.


    It's a pity that people still can't think for themselves.
    ''The Game'' shaped most peoples' views and mindsets relating to ''the community''. Although it is not intentional, people have a hard time seeing people and events from a different light from that in which Neil Strauss presents them. Strauss is a clever man and a good writer, and good stories have more of an effect than most people realise. Simply through, perportedly, sharing Strauss' experience and journey readers relate to him and readily take on his views.
    Strauss is the best PUA, why? Becase he said so. What proof? Thundercat's rating as best PUA. Is Thundercat neutral? No, he is an employee of Strauss. Does it matter? No, because people already relate to, and symethise with, Strauss.
    If we judge the respective men on their merits, TD has undeniably produced a larger volume of more helpful and profound work. He has come up with more methods and theories than Strauss, and he has been more honest. Strauss' annhilation method was literally ASF doctrine tidied up, made more trivial, and put into a well-produced video. And does Strauss actually have any better-than-average posts, even in his ML archive? Not in my opinion.
    The Blueprint is a masterpiece, and i judge TD on his work and respect him in accordance with the quality of his work.
    People buy into the mindsets of those who they idealize. In my opinion, many community members have bought into worse social-conditioning than they had before they found the community.
    RSD is a good company, MM is a good company, Badboy's company is good, PU101 is good, and they have all added something to the community, and they all have bad reviews as well as good ones. Only RSDs bad reviews recieve such attention, and this is because people naturally look for evidence to support the views they obtained from ''The Game'' and the virgin ''Thundercat's lair''.
    Appearing confident is not about expressing confidence.
    It is about confidently expressing everything.
    - Wayne Elise
       

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    Agreed with October. I too have read the blueprint draft and I certainly have nothing to do with the commercial vultures.

    TD's writings in general have been the most insightful and improving for my game. I have learnt damn near nothing from Style. He may be a great PUA but he can't convey his understanding of the game like TD can.
       

  96. #96
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    Okay guys. I recently went up to LA for a free seminar RSD was holding taught by Jeffy (Jlaix). It was 8 hours, and this free seminar BLEW my mind. It was AWESOME, and the best seminar I ever attended, oh and it was FREE. I met Jlaix, TD, Papa, Ozzie, Tim - all of whom are fucking cool guys.

    RSD is awesome, and if I were to decide to ever do a program from any company, it would be them.

    RSD and PU101 are THE leading companies.
       

  97. #97
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    but anyways about the bootcamps, how about the dvd`s?? are they a complete ripoff too or are they actually a good purchase, because TD is a great PUA too and he has some great theories, or they are just being repeated over and over??
       

  98. #98
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    adan: I heard good reviews about it on ASF. But I listened/watched it and its really just the same shit hes said before, in my opinion.
       

  99. #99
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    TD Foundations

    Whatever you think of Tyler, he definitely is one of the pua-gurus and a voice to be acknowledged (very strange that Thundercat does not even mention him in his 2005 ranking of the best puas). After having read some of his posts (the Tyler-digest), I recently saw his DVDs Foundations.
    Summary:
    The DVDs are very good and probably worth the high price, though, in my opinion, not as good as Mysterys. Probably, one should see both products because they are complementary and focus on different levels. While it is actually Mystery who laid the foundations of modern pick-up, Tyler gives helpful additional information, which can be included in the Mystery Method.
    General:
    The DVDs are well done and high quality. Tyler is very good and clear in presenting his ideas- in contrast to his writing which is ok, but not great- he needs massive space to lay out ideas and most of his stuff could be written more to the point (e.g., even the presentation for the DVDs on his webside is pages too long!). He has become a little bigger since his earlier days and does not seem to be so exaggeratedly hyped anymore. Generally, he seems to be trustworthy and very rarely bragging (also contrary to his earlier writing) although for many of his statements I would love to see live-proof, if these techniques really work in the field (unfortunately, his bootcamps are too expensive for my taste- especially taking into account the very varying reviews about their quality).
    What is a little bit annoying is that Tyler often engages in cross-selling. He hints that he has much deeper knowledge than presented on the DVDs probably as an incentive to take his bootcamps. For that price of the DVDs, I would have expected a full disclosure.
    Content:
    Tyler has developed some new concepts that are very helpful while many other things on the DVDs can be found in other writings which in my opinion is ok because it makes sense to teach also other gurus wisdoms. Some of his helpful concepts include:
    Secret society and double standards;
    Buying temperature;
    Dealing with amogs (Tyler always was leading in this area);
    Elastic snap band effect;
    Being non-reactive.

    Tyler gives lots of techniques and practical tips for a complete pick-up though, in my opinion, there could have been even more techniques. Often, he is a little bit vague, giving the 20.000 feet overview without any practical ideas how to apply these techniques. Again, his content could be more dense.

    Still, in the modern pick-up world where mediocre products abound, these DVDs are a highlight. I would definitely include them in the top 10 pua products that are on the market (not that I know them all, though)
       

  100. #100
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    2007 is RSDs year...

    I used to be heavy in MM but now I see RSD is on some new concepts and is actually real good. Everything they've been releasing is new stuff.

    Blueprint is going to be crazy and I'm now realizing why they don't use routines no more. They have a few other good stuff coming out. Don't sleep on RSD.
       

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