Feminism and PUA

[milts]

Feminism and PUA

I hear the word 'Feminism' thrown around here from time to time and as a feminist I feel it's time to set some things straight. I'm not usually one for over-the-top political correctness but as someone who works with victims of domestic violence if feel it's important in this case.

I'm sure there are better ones but here is the wiki definition: Feminism refers to movements aimed at establishing and defending equal political, economic, and social rights and equal opportunities for women

There are many different schools of feminism (some very conflicting) but this definition more or less reflects the general thread running through most of them.

Feminism is far more concerned with equal opportunities for women within Political, Economic, and Social spheres than it is with dating/romance. For example: women in politics, equality in the workplace, being free from patriarchy within families and relationship including domestic violence etc.

If you support these things - you are a feminist! (ha! deal with it)

Women have struggled hard over the centuries to slowly win these victories and they deserve our fucking respect and support! In many parts of the world and even to an extent within our own developed countries the battle is far from over.

Now I know what you're all thinking - feminism has turned the last two generations of men into pussies- hence the birth of the AFC.

Well I totally agree. And there are many fantastic topics on here about reclaiming manhood and I support them.

But this was not the intent of feminism. It is an unfortunate byproduct. There may be some schools of feminism that want to demasculate men but they are a tiny minority.

Most feminists do not deny biological gender roles If they did you would hear them calling for men to give birth, women to do the heavy lifting or be the protectors.

Feminists to not 'hate men' or are 'anti romance' or against the man taking the lead in a romantic/dating context. Of course the line is drawn when the man feels that by virtue of being a man he may control the woman (make a distinction between the word control and lead). This is patriarchy and is totally unacceptable - as we would all agree.

So really this post is all about the use of the word 'feminism' and misconceptions about what feminism is. If you want to talk about men being pussies, reclaiming manhood, AFC's etc no problem but please remember that while this may have been the result of feminism it is not what feminism is all about.

Of course you will hear many feminists speak out against the seduction community/dating science but this is less to do with them being feminists and more to do with them not understanding what the seduction community is all about- just like everyone else in society.

I've made my point already but I'll go further and say that the reason dating science for men is so heavily criticised (as opposed the dating advice for women in Cosmo etc) is due to a long standing patriarchal belief that sex is something that men do, and something that women have done to them. Of course that is nonsense and is something that pro-sex feminists talk about a lot. Ask yourself whether you actually believe that statement next time you are about to call a girl a slut or you are pissed off that your girl has slept with more people than you.

Peace out!

[DeadEyeDick]

Moved from General Discussion, which is not for theoretical rants. Thanks.

[rafalluz]

that the reason dating science for men is so heavily criticised (as opposed the dating advice for women in Cosmo etc) is due to a long standing patriarchal belief that sex is something that men do, and something that women have done to them. Of course that is nonsense and is something that pro-sex feminists talk about a lot. Ask yourself whether you actually believe that statement next time you are about to call a girl a slut or you are pissed off that your girl has slept with more people than you.

Any "dating science school", or whatever you want to call it, that supports such "point of view" is worthless. People here clearly do not support this, in majority.

[rhettro84]

In this regard there's a conceptual non-liberal writer, Jim Kalb, who is worth quoting:

"Feminism” means so many different things that it appears to mean very little. Its theoretical advocates constantly contradict each other and themselves. In casting off feminine reserve and modesty they seem to have learned intellectual shamelessness as well. Rather than damaging feminism, its incoherence offers an easy defense against all criticism: whatever the complaint, the response is that it misses the mark because feminism is really something else.

It appears, however, that nothing can be called feminism that is not radically antitraditional and antinatural. What feminists call “gender”—the system of attitudes, expectations and customs that distinguishes men from women—has always and everywhere been basic to human life. To speak of “deeply rooted social stereotypes” is to speak of the centrality of masculinity and femininity to how we understand the world. Grammatical gender is one sign among many of that centrality. Although the detailed content of sexual distinctions has varied somewhat their general outlines have been stable. The men and women in ancient and non-Western literatures are immediately recognizable to us today as men and women like ourselves. Yang strikes us as masculine, Yin as feminine, just as they did the ancient Chinese.

And so on. Now, I and everyone reading this are familiar with all the replies and retorts--we've all been schooled by our media/academic priesthood--so people air them here for their own reflexive satisfaction rather than for the benefit of the group. Just live with this fact: some people wholly decline to accept feminism in principle, and they have reflective reasons for doing so. It won't do to write anti-feminist or non-feminist attitudes off onto aggression, misogyny, pathology, misunderstanding, or whatever.

It's also worth observing that feminism thrives at least in part because of PC social and professional pressure--no less than Larry Summers, for example, nearly lost his job merely for expressing a mild non-feminist opinion. In that climate there's no such thing as a fair and honest discussion, so let's not pretend we're about to have one over this.

[Luciiz]

Let's be honest here guys. Strip away any PC nonsense. Women are creatively inferior to men. And I mean the word 'creatively' in every sense of the word - invention, theories and models, philosophy analysis of human behaviour - essentially the architecture to life as we know it.

[spectre trip9]

Let's be honest here guys. Strip away any PC nonsense. Women are creatively inferior to men. And I mean the word 'creatively' in every sense of the word - invention, theories and models, philosophy analysis of human behaviour - essentially the architecture to life as we know it.

The two sexes are not equal. It's true that (and I'm generalizing here, there are exceptions and crossovers between the two) men are just better than women at some things. But if you'd do a little research, you'd know that the average woman is much better than the average man at several other things.

You say "creatively" inferior, but your post reeks of sexism. And I don't even see what your post has to do with what the OP is talking about.

To say one is inferior is ignorant. We're different, that's all.

[miaddict]

Moved from General Discussion, which is not for theoretical rants. Thanks.

This is essentially a debate about "which is bigger: my dick or your clit?".

[rhettro84]

This is essentially a debate about "which is bigger: my dick or your clit?".

Don't even go there. My clit is enormous.

[Luciiz]

The two sexes are not equal. It's true that (and I'm generalizing here, there are exceptions and crossovers between the two) men are just better than women at some things. But if you'd do a little research, you'd know that the average woman is much better than the average man at several other things.

You say "creatively" inferior, but your post reeks of sexism. And I don't even see what your post has to do with what the OP is talking about.

To say one is inferior is ignorant. We're different, that's all.

Take my post as you want. The masculine of the human race has to invent and in many ways become more unique than women. Females perceptive skills (I guess, a type of intelligence) in finding a particular mate are much higher.

No need to go WAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHH sexism if you can't handle the blatant truth, bro.

[TrueStory]

This conversation is pointless for many reasons, let me point out few:

1. - There is no strict definition of Feminism. Similarly to a religion it can have loose interpretation and deviation from mainstream practices; one way or another, there is no concrete definition of what it is.
2. - Any misguided person that uses logic "X group supports Y issue, if you support Y issue you are X group......" loses all points from then on. For example: Communists supported affordable healthcare for everyone, education for all, government assistance to poor people, everyone being equal and financially cared, etc. etc.for....soooo if you support these issues, by all means you're a Commie. See how fucked up this logic is?
3. - It's unfortunate that very small minority of people actually share Original Poster's ideas of how feminists should focus on equality first. Well, few feminists out there share this idea and you could hardly call them "feminists" to begin with.
4. - Most young feminists are mislead and brainwashed by feminist "leaders" that should never be allowed around gullible people. There is a lot of negativity floating around feminist agenda, if you cannot see this, you're blind, just like above mentioned leaders.
5. - Considering this post is coming from a guy, it can be unbiased, but it seems like OP has been spending a lot of time working with "men hating feminist women" in his line of work, am i right?
6. - There are several topics at hand on this post; equality, differences, sexism, feminism, interpretation of above, etc.
7. - There is major misconception about "superiority" of sexes. I will put all my savings on a bet that average man is stronger than average woman when it comes to lifting weight. Does this mean man has superior strength than a woman? Absolutely. It still does not make male sex superior. We can continue argue that, like idiots, that "we are all different" and continue agreeing/disagreeing.
8. - What is the point of this post altogether? It does not help anyone to meet women.
9. - Proving a point on the Internet is like winning special Olympics.....