Discuss Casually Dating HB9.5- Status on V-Day Uncertain- Help? at the Newbie Discussion Forum within the PUA Forums | The Attraction Forums | The Mystery Method; Casually Dating HB9.5- Status on V-Day Uncertain- Help?
So today's Love Systems, formerly Mystery Method ...
Casually Dating HB9.5- Status on V-Day Uncertain- Help?
So today's LS Email issue was helpful in breaking down the categories and frames from which you'll be addressing V-day. Thanks Savoy, it was very helpful.
The crux of my issue lies in the ambiguity of the status of my current "relationship" and not knowing which of the three categories I should be launching from... the committed relationship, or the casually dating.
(CAVEAT: This is going to be long, i believe context is necessary... and this i my first post in the forums, so forgive me if i'm breaching protocol)
I've been casually dating this HB9.5 who is 19 (I'm 27) for over a month and everything has gone great. She is definitely attracted to me and I've experienced no hangups whatsoever in building attraction, F-close and have built comfort. She's very forthcoming with how she feels about me and is always calling me to hang out, stay over etc. I'm definitely interested in turning this into a LTR. I have been patient in letting her bring up the "status" talk and will occasionally still run a jealousy routine on her about girls getting in touch with me and she sees my FB page and all the girls posting on it all the time...so I'm not forcing the issue of committing at all.
So here is the issue: The other night we're in bed and joking around and in response to a joke of mine she says "boys... " in kind of a cute and dismissive way.
I counter with " Obviously you mean.. Men...boys aren't THIS sexy.." (gesturing to myself)
Her: She laughs and says "Well you're in my phone as..The Boy..."
I say: "Oh T-H-E Boy eh?"
Her: "yeah, AND no one says Manfriend..."
Me: "So are you saying that makes me your boyfriend?"
(*here is where it gets weird)
Her: she just pauses for a minute like she is thinking about it...
Me: I assumed that she may have been shaken by my dismissive tone and so I say... "you know thats not necessarily a problem."
Her: she is still pausing and not saying anything...
Me: ( It's only been fractions of seconds and hasn't been long enough to get awkward yet ...I've got a pretty good sense of conversation timing etc.) so I jump back into the joking with:
"... you know if you're going to force me into it like this i mean it would be rude not to go along with it... I mean, I really don't want to because you're kind of boring.... but...." and I trail off because she is laughing and we just start making out again...I know I deflected well because things haven't changed at all on her end on how she responds to me and contacts me.
So here is my dilemma in a nutshell: I'm ok with not classifying what we have because everything is great and I have no reason to force it and am confident it will resolve in time. She gives every sign that she considers me to be her boyfriend ( i know she is not seeing other people because she is with me more often than not ) although she hasn't pressured me for any sort of classification either... The final question is: Where does that leave me for Valentine's day???
I don't want to go into the committed relationship V-day style and blow it early with too much to fast... but I don't want to blow her off either if she sees this as a bf/gf thing.
Well you have been seeing her for a month. What do you want out of this relationship? Do you want to continue down the path and make her your girlfriend, or would you rather be fuck buddies? She is already classifying you as her boyfriend, so do you want the role?
Yeah I'd like to make it a relationship for sure. The problem is that even though her actions classify me as the BF, she has balked when given the opportunity to verbalize it. Usually I wouldn't care, but for me... the direction that I take Valentines day depends on how I think SHE perceives the relationship.
Originally Posted by CMPitts
One thing I DO NOT want to do is to take the committed relationship route when she's still on the 'casual' page... because then I lose the benefit of her chasing me and me being the prize. Suddenly she is put in a position where she could have it both ways. I want to avoid that.
(EDIT: BTW, I really appreciate the response. Thanks!)
FOLLOWUP: This is kind of what I have planned but it's flexible.
Last week I told her that I have to bartend for a private party on Valentines day and that I won't be available until afterward. In a separate conversation ( so as to separate it as a "replacement" for valentines day) I told her I'd like to take her out to dinner "friday night" ( the night before v-day ).... and I plan on basically making it a "full meal deal" of a nice place, dressing up etc but without the flowers and chocolate stuff of a committed relationship.
Well, she is only 19, she might have trouble verbalizing her feelings. Instead of taking her out to dinner, why don't you cook a meal instead? You're 27, so I assume you have your own place. Find an easy recipe, cook dinner, watch a funny movie, cuddle, and fuck.
Thats a good thought CMPitts.... not bad at all. I'll stew on it a bit.
Originally Posted by CMPitts
I think you may be onto something with the age/verbalizing thing. She's easy flowing with the compliments and telling me how I make her feel... but maybe putting herself out there for the "comit" is uncomfortabl. I'm not used to dating girls so much younger. I've dated a couple years younger, and even 10+ years older... but never 8 years younger. Might be something to that....
This may backfire, but i think that big risks equal big rewards:
If you're serious about really wanting to be her boyfriend and be in a committed relationship with her, then I would definitely play up the Valentine's Day angle and make it as romantic as possible. Do what Savoy said in his LSI email under the "boyfriend/girlfriend" part.
I give this advice because you have ALREADY SLEPT WITH HER. For those of you reading this posting who haven't slept with your girl yet, this advice does not apply to you!
Act as if you ALREADY ARE her boyfriend, and if she's into it, she will accept the frame and follow your lead... and it may quickly accelerate the two of you being boyfriend & girlfriend with each other. It's very likely that she's waiting for you to take the lead and "be the man" on this one.
If she's not into it, it is very possible that the chemistry will change between the two of you and you may possibly lose what you have now. But I think it's a risk worth taking. As Soul says, go for what you want... as long as you treat people with respect along the way.
At the very least, it gives her the opportunity to respond with a conversation about how she feels you guys are to each other. If she's enjoying being physical with you, it's highly unlikely that she'll withdraw that from you altogether at this point, but it could happen. If she's not into it, it gives you the opportunity to pursue other women, or lay low for a while as you continue to work on a relationship with her.
In any case, I say go for it and make Valentine's Day a big deal. I think this is a risk worth taking.
Wow, thanks Kisser. Thats a 180 from the other angle... lots to consider.
Originally Posted by kisser
Your angle is ballsy. I like that. I get the sense she is used to guys falling over themselves to date her though ( i probably should've mentioned that before) because she's definitely a HB9.5.
I've definitely achieved and maintained the upper hand through DHV and have made her chase me... which is something I know she is not used to. She articulated that. So I'm a little apprehensive about potentially undermining that... do you think it's a worthwhile concern? (along with her being used to guys falling over themselves for her) or because it's V-day it's a non-issue?
Thanks again for the response.
Although guys are constantly falling over themselves to be with her, remember that you are actually HAVING SEX WITH HER! So this puts you in a different league.
Originally Posted by punqroqclimber
Many of us Love Systems instructors enjoy having multiple fuck-buddies or multiple long-term relationships simultaneously (Savoy just released the Relationship Management DVD which talks a lot about this), so it sounds like you already have a great thing going. But if you're certain that you want to escalate this to be in a committed relationship with her, only you would know if you would lose her altogether by getting too romantic, too quickly. So if you personally are feeling a little gun-shy about going full-force into the romantic Valentine's Day thing, you may need to start prying into her mindset a little bit more with direct relationship-type conversations & questions. This is also fairly ballsy, but it can be incredibly effective at letting you know where a woman stands.
For example, you may want to simply come right out and ask her:
"How do you typically like to spend Valentine's Day with the guys that you're romantic with?"
Notice that you use guys (plural) to imply that you're okay with that she may be sleeping with other guys. Also, you used the word "romantic with" instead of "sleeping with" or "dating" -- this gives her the opportunity to interpret "romance" however she wants. This may lead her to immediately open up to how she feels about you. She may even offer the information that she only wants you as a fuck-buddy and nothing more. Be prepared for whatever information -- positive or negative -- that comes out of this conversation. And be emotionally unreactive if she says something that you don't want to hear. Just take it all in. She might be testing you.
Another excellent "relationship conversation starter" would be something like this:
"My good friend Maggie came over the other night to cook me dinner, and we started talking about the 2 different types of relationships out there... and it got me curious. Are you the type of girl who enjoys more of the "single and free" lifestyle, or are you the type of girl who enjoys having a boyfriend?"
(There's actually way more than 2 different types of relationships, as Savoy discusses in his DVD, but it simplifies things for the sake of this conversation-starter.) This one question alone could open up insight that you haven't known about her before. The fact that you had a female friend coming over to cook you dinner might trigger some jealousy in her as well, which could also help her reveal her emotional feelings for you.
You can use the answers to those questions to gauge your next move.
Oh, one other thing -- if you're feeling like you still need to be more of a challenge for her at this point (since being challenging is one of the attraction triggers), then you can do what Savoy suggested in his LSI under the heading of "If you've been dating someone but she's not your girlfriend or close to it...", then simply ask her out to a group Valentine's event. A double-date, or a big Valentines Party, something like that.