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Discuss Teasing vs. CF vs. Negging - this is clarification at the General Discussion within the The Attraction Forums. Dating Advice.; Teasing vs. CF vs. Negging - this is clarification A lot of people get these ...
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    ware_ru is offline Certified Live Training Graduate Lounge Member
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    Teasing vs. CF vs. Negging - this is clarification

    A lot of people get these concepts mixed up and use them interchangeably. They are not identical. Here are two of my old posts about clarifying:

    the official party line of TMM definitely, and probably of VA as well, is that a neg is a false disqualifier. They make the girl think yo uare NOT pursuing her.

    TEASING AND COCKY FUNNY ARE FLIRTING. Everyone who isn't a social retard knows that they are flirting (albeit competent flirting). A neg, on the other hand, is an FDQ, ONLY.

    Teasing is an ioi and iod wrapped into one. That's why if you tease too early you get bad reactions. They are a way of AMPLIFYING some sort of initial attraction, because once she is attracted, you can throw iois and hit on her. But if she's not even remotely attracted and you try to tease her she thinks "wtf this loser is trying to tease me? i'm cooler than him, what a fucking loser wtf."

    A neg is a FALSE DISQUALIFIER, ONLY. ONLY ONLY ONLY. If we are going to make pickup into a science we have to try to be as correct as possible.
    Cocky funny (depending on how its used; and it should generally be used as a playful form of teasing, not as an asshole-ish move) is a DHV and an IOI. It is competent flirting - like teasing. If you call a girl a nerd or a dork or you hipcheck her you are

    1) demonstrating that you are fine just having a fun time and you're not taking the interaction too stiffly and you're a fun guy (DHV) but at the same time 2) it is VERY clear to a person that teasing is an ioi. You don't tease a bum on the streets. A girl doesn't slap you on the arm if she actually is disinterested in you (except for fake ioi's but that's totally differenT).

    it is NOT an FDQ. If you call a girl a nerd she KNOWS you are teasing her - she knows you are flirting with her - it's you showing her you like her and can have fun with her but you're doing it in a competent manner. That's why cocky funny sometimes doesn't work immediately off the bat because you haven't established the unreactiveness and flipped the value switch that's required before you can really nail it and the girls LET you establish that frame where you're cooler than them/teasing them



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    Vapor is offline Administrator Emeritus
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    As long as you aren't using sarcasm, they pretty much all serve the same function.
    A neg is a FALSE DISQUALIFIER, ONLY. ONLY ONLY ONLY.
    I've seen Sinn describe obvious teasing as a "neg." It's not the most literal version of it, but the meaning has evolved since guys got away from "Nice nails, are they real?" and other physical negs that are a) unnecessary and b) usually fucked up.
    When I am writing in red, it's as an Attraction Forums mod or admin. When I write in normal text, it's just me.

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    This is very good stuff.

    Many guys need to read this over and over.
    The ghost of pua's past.

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    Guys who want to game should be forced to read and sign this at the entrance to clubs, bars, restaurants, Hooters, shopping malls, strip clubs and the Forum.

    Great post/re-post.

    Sho nuff.

    By any means necessary.
    When I am writing in red, it's as an Attraction Forums Admin. When I write in normal text, it's just me.

    "I remember the first time I had sex; I still have the receipt!" -- Groucho Marx

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    A Philosophy of Abundance | Learn Seduction | Online Sarging | Negs Explained

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vapor View Post
    As long as you aren't using sarcasm, they pretty much all serve the same function.

    I've seen Sinn describe obvious teasing as a "neg." It's not the most literal version of it, but the meaning has evolved since guys got away from "Nice nails, are they real?" and other physical negs that are a) unnecessary and b) usually fucked up.


    I think the more playful the neg, the less of an IOD it is. I never use negs anymore that aren't playful (=teasing), because you can easily come off as socially unintelligent.
    I think the best way you can go about A2 is to mix these playful negs/teases/banter etc with legitimate-looking IODs.
    For example LD wrote this a few months ago, which may clarify the point:


    "Yes this is flirting and will be interpreted as compentent interest. This is more what I would call buying temperature game.

    Try also playing with IODs that aren't flirty, but that seem to legitimately - albeit a bit inadvertantly - convey disinterest.

    Many PUAs make the mistake of using IOIs and IODs that are too abrupt and intense. Contrast a backturn, which is quite harsh, with this move:

    Over the course of 4 to 5 seconds, lean your head back (like you are moving it away from the target) about 3 inches, while closing your lips. Maintain eye contact but without saying anything.
    If the target does not re-initiate conversation, feel free to continue talking at this point. People FEEL IODs like this because they come off real."



    In summary you are guy who is fun, social, can fuck around and flirt etc, but
    at the same time, you might have better places to be.
    Last edited by spearhead21; 10-23-2007 at 12:40 PM.

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    Teasing is an ioi and iod wrapped into one. That's why if you tease too early you get bad reactions. They are a way of AMPLIFYING some sort of initial attraction, because once she is attracted, you can throw iois and hit on her. But if she's not even remotely attracted and you try to tease her she thinks "wtf this loser is trying to tease me? i'm cooler than him, what a fucking loser wtf."
    Ha now i understand why, when i teased too early why i got blown out.
    Thanks ware ru.

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    ware_ru is offline Certified Live Training Graduate Lounge Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by spearhead21 View Post
    I think the more playful the neg, the less of an IOD it is. I never use negs anymore that aren't playful (=teasing), because you can easily come off as socially unintelligent.
    I think the best way you can go about A2 is to mix these playful negs/teases/banter etc with legitimate-looking IODs.
    For example LD wrote this a few months ago, which may clarify the point:


    "Yes this is flirting and will be interpreted as compentent interest. This is more what I would call buying temperature game.

    Try also playing with IODs that aren't flirty, but that seem to legitimately - albeit a bit inadvertantly - convey disinterest.

    Many PUAs make the mistake of using IOIs and IODs that are too abrupt and intense. Contrast a backturn, which is quite harsh, with this move:

    Over the course of 4 to 5 seconds, lean your head back (like you are moving it away from the target) about 3 inches, while closing your lips. Maintain eye contact but without saying anything.
    If the target does not re-initiate conversation, feel free to continue talking at this point. People FEEL IODs like this because they come off real."



    In summary you are guy who is fun, social, can fuck around and flirt etc, but
    at the same time, you might have better places to be.
    great followup, can you tell me where the original is? (pm if you have to)

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    ware_ru is offline Certified Live Training Graduate Lounge Member
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    cf and teasing are kind of similar and the problem is that CF encompasses both an entire attitude of "I'm the coolest fucking guy" but also particular lines that acan be construed as teasing as well. The main bifurcation is between teasing and negging which are NOT THE SAME. THEY SERVE MASSIVELY DIFFERENT PURPOSES

    I disagree with vapor on "they all prettymuch serve the same purpose if yo'ure not being sarcastic." Mentioning your girlfriend is a neg, or mentioning "You know it's too bad I don't date brunettes because yo'ure very pretty" serve a VERY different purpose from "oh my god yo'ure such a dork get away from me before it rubs off on me."

    (btw for anyone who doesn't know: "sarcasm is when you say something good but mean something bad. teasing is when you say something bad but you really mean 'i love you'." Credit to Juggler for that piece of info, and I've actually said it a few times in set and it hits. It's a good bit.)

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    Cocky and Funny itself is a form of a FDQ because it shows that you're not trying to impress her and that's what FDQ's do.

    And it seems to me that all good FDQ's have a touch of IOI's in it. Only full IOD I can think of is if you don't even acknowledge her or punch her in the face for fun.


    I think what's more important is the FALSE part.


    Edit: Although, this thread has opened up my mind to broader thinking.

    Since cocky and funny also does other things than just show disinterest in her sexual power over you, I guess you are right in saying they're not the same thing. I don't agree that they're vastly different though.

    Upon initial meeting a hot chick, I think cocky and funny does serve to IOD her hotness. If teasing is an IOI, then you could argue that neg is an IOI too, because why would someone neg anyone that they're not interested in? Why would someone go up to a bum and neg him either?

    I think all those have elements of both IOI and IOD in them. Just by virtue of talking to someone, even asking an opinion has a bit of IOI since you care about their opinion.
    Last edited by AFChimp; 10-23-2007 at 06:09 PM.

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