bootcamps!

zeus26 · #1 (**permalink**) 07-31-2008, 09:36 AM

hey guys, i'm looking to do a bootcamp but i cant find the right one for me. have you seen anything around $1000 or cheaper? i'm looking for a comprehensive bootcamp. there are day game bootcamps that fit my budget but im looking for something a bit more extensive.

Vapor · #2 (**permalink**) 07-31-2008, 09:48 AM

There's no such thing from anybody reputable. You can't hire somebody for that many hours over three days, plus their travel and all, and have it worth their while. Nobody who has any demand for their services (e.g., are any good) would do that. I would regard anybody who would with extreme suspcion.

As for "comprehensive," the bootcamps here are very comprehensive. In field day game isn't taught, but that's because you are supposed to learn night game first. Charisma Arts (Juggler's guys) teaches day and night game at their bootcamps, but they aren't close to your price.

Your best bet is to get more funds.

HTH

BigDuke6 · #3 (**permalink**) 07-31-2008, 04:18 PM

How about getting a one-on-one in-field tutor for the evening? That would be valuable experience gained. Not exactly a bootcamp, though.

zeus26 · #4 (**permalink**) 07-31-2008, 05:11 PM

that makes sense. have you had any experience with those? wheres a good website to find one?

chris3 · #5 (**permalink**) 08-01-2008, 01:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vapor

There's no such thing from anybody reputable.
HTH

AFC adam does bootcamps for that price. Spear did a few at that price last year. Sinn and ell toppo now does them for about $1500.

Max and london playboy (formaly mystery method insructors) are based in london and have verry reasonable rates. Depends were you are. If you shop around you could find something. There are some good deals about

Vapor · #6 (**permalink**) 08-01-2008, 08:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chris3

AFC adam does bootcamps for that price.

Associated with Gambler, not a reputable company IMO.

Quote:

Spear did a few at that price last year.

Never heard of him.

Quote:

Sinn and ell toppo now does them for about $1500.

Both excellent but charging 50% more than OP's limit.

This seems like as good a place as any to post a few guidelines about what I think makes a reputable company and instructor. I know guys from a few different companies who IMO are solid, and I've met, online and in RL, some frauds who are suckering guys out of their money.

Vapor's Brief but Awesome Guide to Selecting A Pickup Company or Instructor

1. Established Company With A Serious Guarantee
This is THE MOST IMPORTANT factor. If you don't get your money's worth, you get your money back. That means the only thing you are risking is your time. The guarantee is meaningless unless the company has been around a while and has actually issued (hopefully very rare) refunds.

There are also growing pains in the teaching process. The company should have been around at least 18 months to 2 years. If it's an individual, he should have come from one of those companies or been in business himself at least that long. Let somebody else experiment on the new guys with new theories.

2. No Shady/Dishonest Practices
There are lots of guys cashing in on the PU market. Companies/Instructors that spam boards should be immediately disqualified. They may not be getting enough word-of-mouth referrals or recommendations from guys who are already teaching. If they aren't meeting any of the established guys, there may be a reason. Guys like Sinn are pretty upfront about who is good from the other shops.

3. Instructor Talent
Instructors should have DEMONSTRATED pickup skills AND teaching skills. Instructors should have a proven track record of transferring pickup skills to students (e.g., apprentices/instructors who were once students)

4. Instructor Flags
Guys who are good-looking, naturals who have never gone through the learning process, guys who have great sense of humor; avoid them. Sense of humor is an awesome asset but you can't teach it. A solid method is going to have guys who are not particularly handsome, tall, or funny, and who used to suck, getting great results and teaching. If the staff doesn't have any of those guys, you may have a bunch of naturals who put their shingle out and are going to throw out slogans that won't get you better.

Disqualify anybody who does not demonstrate. The last few years you've had a lot of guys working on this stuff, bouncing ideas off each other, field testing, and refining learned social skill. There are lots of guys who can demonstrate VERY impressive skill. Other guys have hidden on the Internet for the last 10 years. There are well known guys out there who nobody has ever seen in set. If guys won't demonstrate, assume they can't.

5. About the Money
This is a tough skill to learn. There aren't a lot of solid guys teaching it. The women and people you spend your time with is one of the most important decisions a man makes in his life. It is worth making an investment in.

neonlite · #7 (**permalink**) 08-01-2008, 09:38 AM

Quick question vapor for reference purposes....

If the instructor already lives in your city or area, would that be able to diminish the cost of a bootcamp?

Vapor · #8 (**permalink**) 08-01-2008, 11:30 AM

Prices tend to be standardized in a specific country, even though it's cheaper to fly into and stay in St. Louis than say, Manhattan. Some cities may be more profitable where you have instructors pre-positioned than others where you have to fly everybody in. But if you have three guys all in town where an instructor lives, they might be able to negotiate something.

chris3 · #9 (**permalink**) 08-01-2008, 07:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vapor

Associated with Gambler, not a reputable company IMO.

.

Vapour I think your last post was verry good.

I took adams bootcamp and before I took it the one thing that realy gave me seconed thaughts was Gambler. Any guy who invents Pussy kino should be shot.
Adams bootcamp turned out to be good though.

Spear is endorced by savoy. I saw a video on U-tube with savoy endorceing spear and another one earlyer with mystery saying he was the seconed best in the world. He was at the lovesystems supper conference and has been on the interview series.

Badboy is endorced by lovesystems but doesn't demo in field. Read the reviews. Saying that his prics in the U.S. arn't bad. My basic rule of thumb is if they have any bad reviews at all forget about them. RSD, Badboy, PUA training (everybody except adam) I realy won't go near.

Apparantly savoy has never given a refund for a bootcamp so does that mean you wouldn't take a lovesystems bootcamp

Vapor · #10 (**permalink**) 08-01-2008, 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chris3

Spear is endorced by savoy. I saw a video on U-tube with savoy endorceing spear and another one earlyer with mystery saying he was the seconed best in the world. He was at the lovesystems supper conference and has been on the interview series.

OK, Speer I have heard of. Those are very solid endorsements.

Quote:

Apparantly savoy has never given a refund for a bootcamp so does that mean you wouldn't take a lovesystems bootcamp

In fact, they have, but it's pretty damn rare (a search confirms this). This is a testament to the quality of the program and instructors, and the motivation of the students. A guy who shelled out a few grand is likely to be motivated, and motivated guys see results.