Dating at work, school, within your social circle, etc.

[Cedar]

Excerpt from OAP Issue April 27, 2005
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1. Dating at work, school, within your social circle, etc.
Some people say: don’t do it.
And that’s a fair argument. You definitely are taking risks. A pickup attempt or a relationship that doesn’t work out can create a bad situation within the group. This can mean as little as a bit of awkwardness or as much as complete alienation from the group. There is usually a loss of social status, and, at work, there may professional issues.
Still, a lot of you are going to do it anyway. And, truth be told, it can be done well. Let’s start with some basic principles:
Don’t start with this until you are good. Your immediate social or professional circle is not the place to practice.
Pickup within your circle is often much more gradual than a “cold approach” – when you meet a woman you don’t know in a public place. Time spent in a company meeting together does not count to the 7-hour rule for example.
The principles of the Mystery Method stay the same, but the tactics become different.
Here’s why the tactics are different.
The Mystery Method is designed for “cold approaches” where you don’t know the woman beforehand and you may be subjected to a limited amount of time. Most social situations, such as parties, restaurants, parks, clubs, or airplanes, fall into this category. The strength of the method lies in Mystery’s ability to take the “normal” pattern of how a relationship develops (which is usually over several weeks) and compress it into a few hours.
Check our last year’s profile of Mystery in Elle Magazine, in which a skeptical female journalist followed us to several bootcamps and reported:
While Mystery refuses to talk about the psychological underpinnings of his Method, several experts I consult testify to its soundness. Desmond Morris, the British zoologist and sexuality expert, admits that the Method is a shrewd compression of the phases of love. “One of the great mistakes men make is not playing all the stages of courtship,” he says. “It has to be done stage by stage if it's going to work.”
For the full Elle Magazine article, visit here (The piece also cites psychology and sexuality experts Cynthia Hazan and Helen Fisher). For some of Desmond Morris’ publications, visit here.
This is an important point. Dating within your circle does not mean expanding or adapting the Mystery Method to a slower-moving social situation. It means putting the underlying principles of the Mystery Method back into their natural habitat.
It’s both harder and easier than you might think
It’s harder because you generally need to be “ON” for a lot more time. You already know, for example, that from meeting a stranger to beginning a sexual relationship with her takes about 7 hours, even if these 7 hours are spread over more than one meeting. However, spending an 8 hour workday in the cubicle next to that attractive woman in marketing does not count the same way. But you still need to be “ON” for those 8 hours. And she’ll still notice any ‘mistakes’ or low-value behavior you exhibit over that time (and tomorrow, and the next day).
On the positive side, you have a lot more time to genuinely exhibit positive characteristics about yourself to her. In an airport lounge, you may have only a few minutes, and therefore have to cram some demonstrations of high value into your conversation very quickly so you catch her interest. See OAP 2 or hear Mystery himself talk about it in this month’s interview series, but you’d need to sign up by Friday to be on April’s list). Someone you see every day can learn about these attractive characteristics of yours “naturally”, over the course of time. She’ll know you date beautiful women because she sees them, not because you subtly implied it. She’ll know you’re confident and the leader of men, because she sees it, not because you artificially constructed a situation that allowed you to demonstrate it. And so on.
However, I use the quotation marks around “naturally” for a reason. Recognizing the slower pace of the interaction does not mean doing nothing. You still need to position yourself and go through the various phases of the Mystery Method. You just don’t have to rush it.
In addition, there are number of tactical differences:
Opinion openers are unnecessary, and opening is easy. So is “hard” qualification (qualification was covered in OAP 3).
Avoid dates. She’s in your circle, so invite her and everyone else out for something fun. Drinks after work, a trip to a club, dinner, whatever. On the surface, it’s just social (and a demonstration that YOU are the leader, since you’re the one who organizes who goes out and where you go). If she’s attracted, she’ll make sure she’s there.
Within your circle, peer endorsement is absolutely crucial. It’s important enough in cold approaches, as her friends should like you a lot to encourage her to leave with you or to see you again. It’s extra important when dealing with mutual friends, since they know you. Time spent managing your social circle is rarely time wasted.
Do NOT put her on the spot. Don’t kiss her where anyone can see. Don’t get into a lot of kino (touching) that would draw attention to you and her. (“Under the table” or “behind the back” kino, where no one can see, is great…adds a bit of scandalousness to it)
In a lot of office/social circle/class romances, A1: opening and A2: attraction generally happen in the day-to-day interactions of your group. This is where living the life of a confident, successful man (as opposed to just putting on this persona when you go out) is important. A3: Qualification, and some of Comfort may also happen here, but more often occurs at a designated group social event.
For example, Samurai (a top Mystery Method instructor) started a new job last fall. He flirted with a number of people in his company over his first few weeks, creating significant attraction. However, it wasn’t until some people from his office went for happy hour after work that he escalated the situation with one of them, and slept with her that night.
This process of escalation is trickier than it may look when in your own circle, because your mutual friends are around. She generally won’t want anyone to know what is happening. However, she likely won’t help you get around this problem, because she doesn’t want to have to participate in her own seduction. This is your job. Remember, seduction must feel natural to a woman. When she thinks about hooking up with a man, the way she wants to remember it is as if it “just happened”. Complicated plots to meet up alone, or temporarily getting her in isolation when no one is looking just to kiss her, don’t feel natural.
So, how do you go from being out with her and your mutual friends to being alone with her at the right time, without your friends noticing and without her feeling awkward? It depends on the situation, but here are some ideas to get you started. You should be able to create your own.
Offer her a ride home if she came without a car, or offer to walk her home
Ask her for a ride home. Even better, get one of your friends to leave early and ask have him ask her to drive you home later since you’d otherwise be stranded.
Just wait. Other people will leave and you might get lucky and end up as the last two people there. [If this happens, you know almost for sure that she is interested]
Similar to “waiting” is the attempt to “shake people off”. If you all went to a restaurant, and people start leaving after dinner, you can invite whomever is left to go with you to a bar down the street where you are supposedly meeting friends. It won’t be as awkward for her to agree in front of other people, but you have a decent chance of getting rid of some people in your group by doing so.
Let’s look at a couple of situations, both a man’s and a woman’s perspective. When reading the man’s story in each example, try to figure out what he did wrong or right.
Example 1: His version
I’m a finance manager at XYZ Corp. One day, I noticed an attractive woman in marketing. For the next little while I saw her in the halls or the elevator, and we’d say hi and smile. A couple weeks later I got up the courage to go over to her cubicle to talk her. We chatted for a while and then I asked her to drinks after work, but she already had plans. We kept seeing each other in the halls, and every once in a while I’d go over to chat and ask her out but she always seemed to have things to do. I just have to wait until she gets less busy and then I’ll take my shot.
Example 1: Her version
I just started in marketing at XYZ Corp. My friends who sit by me are great, but there’s this creepy guy in Finance who hits on me all the time. I thought he was cute when I first saw him, but he never talked to me until all of a sudden he starts coming over and hanging out at my desk. It was really obvious. He asked me out in front of everyone and it became a joke among all of us. Jessica the receptionist said he does the same thing to her.
See what he did wrong? Now let’s look at a better way of doing this.
Example 2: His version
I’m a finance manager at XYZ Corp. One day, I noticed an attractive woman in marketing. I introduced myself, and introduced her around to other people in the company. We saw each other around and would sometimes stop and chat. If I had to go to marketing for something and it was a slow day, I’d sometimes stop for a bit to talk with her and Melanie and Don, who sit beside her. Every few weeks, a bunch of us go to bar for drinks and karaoke after work, so tonight I invited the three of them along.
Example 2: Her version
I just started in marketing at XYZ Corp. My friends who sit by me are great, and there’s a really cute guy in Finance who I like. He was one of my first friends when I started, and we chat or joke around sometimes. He always makes me laugh, and Don and Melanie have good things to say about him. Anyway, he told us that some of the folks were going for drinks and karaoke tonight so of course I’m coming.
Now, let’s take a look at how to escalate. This is a bit harder. Assume that this is a different example, and starts with a group of friends going out to dinner.
Example 3: His version
We were out at dinner, and I sat next to Sandra. Over a few drinks, we talked A LOT. I really felt myself getting somewhere. I got some kino going too, like I had my arm around her after desert for a few minutes. I made a move on her on the dance floor later on, but she said she didn’t want to ruin our friendship (or she “doesn’t date people from work”)
Example 3: Her version
We were out at dinner, and Jim sat next to me. He got really drunk and kept trying to get me to drink. He was really obvious and kept monopolizing my attention so I could only talk to him. When he put his arm around me, I didn’t do anything about it because I didn’t want to be rude, but I was giving “save me” glances to my friends. He tried to kiss me on the dance floor so I had to give him some excuse to get rid of him. Ugh.
Okay, that one was exaggerated for effect. Let’s try something a bit better. Keep trying to guess where things are going right and wrong when reading the guy’s story.
Example 4: His version
We were out at dinner, and I sat next to Sandra. I had a great time, talking with everyone, telling great stories, with everyone listening. A couple of times, Sandra and I had little side conversations, with lots of flirting and casual but friendly touching. After dinner, I caught her alone coming out of the bathroom where no one could see and kissed her. It was a long, passionate makeout, and a giant release of sexual tension. We were hot for each other. I told her we’d need to continue this later with no one around and she agreed. An hour later I told her to say she had car trouble so I’d need to give her a ride home, but she was busy talking to her friends. I sat with her to try to get her attention back to our plan. When she came out of the bathroom later, I tried to do the same kiss move again, but this time it felt awkward and she said our friends would be looking for us. I explained that they didn’t catch us the first time, so they wouldn’t catch us this time, but she was already moving back. A few minutes later I saw her dancing with some guy on the dance floor and giving him her phone number. I went in to make my move before it got too far, told her I was leaving and offered her a ride home (hint, hint). She said she needed to stay with her friends, so I left alone. Today, she told me she was drunk last night and the kiss shouldn’t have happened.
Example 4: Her version
We were out at dinner, and Jim sat next to me. I was so attracted to him at first, and then we shared a really hot kiss by the bar. That sort of got it out of the system for me, but he wanted more. He was all clingy and creepy, kind of hanging off of me the rest of the night – totally not the guy I thought he was! I had an awkward moment this morning letting him down.
Let’s break this one down and see what really happened…
Example 4: What really happened
Jim did everything right until the kiss. The kiss was unnecessary there and then. Jim probably did it to make sure that Sandra was into him. That might have been okay if it were quick, but a long drawn-out makeout actually dissipated the sexual tension. Jim was no longer someone Sandra was trying to attract; she knew she had him already. He should have let the sexual tension continue to build until he was somewhere where he could have taken advantage of it.
After the kiss, things really went downhill. Jim became submissive and clingy, instead of the confident man Sandra had been attracted to. He tried to involve Sandra in a little conspiracy to be alone together, which bored her and turned her off. As an attractive woman, she knows how to get alone with men. She’s also been alone with men who made everything feel natural. This didn’t feel very natural or fun to her. Then Jim started retracing old ground (the same kiss) hoping to re-create the same result. This sealed his fate. For Jim to have won her back that night, he probably would have needed to introduce a jealousy plotline.
Example 5: His version
We were out at dinner, and I sat next to Sandra. I had a great time, talking with everyone, telling great stories, with everyone listening. A couple of times, Sandra and I had little side conversations, with lots of flirting and casual but friendly touching. I was hanging out with other people after dinner, but we kept gravitating back to each other. When there were only 5 of us left, I suggested we all go to a club down the street when my friend was DJing and I was meeting some friends. Sandra said she’s come along, so I made a big show of trying to convince the others to come too so it didn’t look obvious, and to give Sandra more of a challenge. Joe from accounting did come along, but I kept feeding him alcohol and introducing him to women until he disappeared. Sandra and I had a quick kiss on the dance floor, which I stopped first. An hour later, we left together.
Example 5: Her version
We were out at dinner, and Jim sat next to me. I was pretty into him, so when he was about to go to this club down the street, I went with him. I told Jessica that I’d just take a taxi home, but I wanted to stay out a bit longer and party. Joe from accounting followed me, of course, since he’s always hitting on me, but Jim did a great job getting rid of him without making it awkward. I ended up back at Jim’s apartment an hour later. I told him I could only come in for a minute, but now it’s 7am and I have to go home and change!
Are these his & her examples helpful? It’s sort of a new style for us. Write me at Francis@mysterymethod.com and let me know.

Who wants to change their abilities with women and dating FOREVER?

[obie]

One important point that is true in my experience was left out of the OAP.
In-social-circle sarging is heavily influenced by preselection and social proof, both of which can work for you or against you. The cold approach is also influenced by these things, but in a cold approach both of these things are easier to control, since on a cold approach they are really only based on first impressions, whereas in ISCS they are actually evident to the women in the social circle.
One of the consequences of this is that if you blow a sarge with one woman in a social group, you have effectively blown it will all the girls in that social group. On the other hand if you have succesfully sarged a woman (and delivered the goods ) you will come demonstrably preselected... plus all her friends will hear about how good the sex was and will want some.
Both of these things are important to keep in mind...

[.Cadmus.]

i personally loved this issue of the newsletter
the new style of writing is perfect to learn from. i even shot him an email telling him but i got an automated "im busy so send this message again to a more precise category based email of mine"
the email asked him to even, down the road, switch up the order of right way and wrong way to do it, to 'test' the readers knowledge. with that tiny bit of lack of predictability, it could really jazz up the seduction material