A State of Affairs: The Truth About the Under-21 Convention

[Sheek]

I’d like to begin by saying that I wish I didn’t have to write this post. That I wished the Under-21 Convention was going to be the best thing that happened to the teen pickup community. That the whole thing was worth paying close to a thousand dollars for; for all the hotel stays, the meals, the club entry fees, and so on. Unfortunately, that is not the case.

I was excited about the convention. I thought Dream/antman, the organizer, was a great PUA. When I found out he only had one lay, courtesy of his prom date, I was a bit disappointed, but I still thought the convention was going to rock. After all, we had some awesome speakers ready to present everything they knew to the attendees. They were going to share things that would rock the foundations of the Under-21 community.

Those of us planning the convention were members of a secret forum called The Dream Lounge. We worked hard at planning out how the convention would pan out, how attendees were going to be split up daily with a new coach to learn a new aspect of game, how we were going to do some awesome visual stuff, and so on.

As time progressed however, Dream began his downwards spiral. At first, a scandal with Rewok erupted. Rewok complained, in truth, that The Dream Lounge was becoming infested with Floridians from Orlando, what with Dream letting them in without subjecting his friends to our vote-in policy. It just so happened that Rewok spent hours and hours of work on the convention, helping me with the Under-21 website layout, referring the most users by far out of anyone else to the Under-21 Convention boards, posting a lot of field reports, and so on. Dream got a bit upset, and, against all our wishes, Rewok was banned from the forum.

In the meantime, Dynamic – a former MysteryMethod instructor – moved in with Dream. Dream got angry about Dynamic scratching his Gears of War game disc, so he kicked Dynamic out of his house, banned him from The Dream Lounge, and wrote a page-long thread about why Dynamic was a fraud.

On the Under-21 Convention boards one day, someone replied to a field report from Dream asking how many lays he had. Rewok posted:

“ One.
- Rewok”

and was banned from the forums that he almost single-handedly brought to life. I was outraged, so I made my own thread detailing Dream’s behaviour. I was promptly banned from the forums there as well, negating all the work I had put into the convention myself. I was set to be the M.C./introducer, basically the guy that entertained you guys in between serious presentations. I kinda said goodbye to that.

So back to the convention itself. It turns out, from what I hear, Dream is now offering “bootcamps” to people that come to the convention, which he once claimed was non-profit. Taking bootcamps from someone with no lays from over 1,500 approaches is not my idea of a great way to spend money.

As most of you can imagine, this didn’t go down too well with the convention staff. To quote Dream:

Every single one of the original speakers has flaked at this point aside from myself… EVERYONE.

devious
hawt
sheek
maverick
zine
vincent chase
crono
heartwork

None of the speakers are coming to the convention anymore. None of them. Nil. Zip. The only reason why you would want to come to the convention in the first place is gone. As of now, I would seriously recommend AGAINST attending the convention, because, to put it simply, it will be a waste of a plane ticket. Go to Mexico instead, I heard the food is awesome.

Not to worry, though. The six strongest speakers at the convention have formed a pact called the Sinister Sixx, and we will be releasing articles about the topics we were set to discuss at the convention before the convention even starts. The Sinister Sixx articles are available for sure on the RSD forums, and I am not sure about any others.

Again, sorry I had to post this. I wish the convention was going to be all it was hyped up to be, but that just isn’t going to happen.

- Sheek

Who wants to change their abilities with women and dating FOREVER?

[antman]

Yet another thread trying to discredit myself and the convention. He even made it in the wrong forum (would have had a lot more views in the main forum buddy).

I just skimmed over this and will respond to anything I feel fit.

*Ive done basically all of the planning work single handedly. This forum we made helped a little but its been basically all of my effort.

*Sheek your a drama queen.

*You, vincent chase, and rewok, had nothing to do with the website. You had months to work on it and ultimatley some guy I work with did it, and then Hawt fixed it up.

*Your twisting shit and adding/removing certain parts, kind of like the media.

*If anyone has any questions about "dynamic" read savoys blog , or just ask him via pm. Dynamic is a con artist. Hence he was fired for posting fake LRs and student reviews.

*Rewok was banned for stirring up trouble on www.///////////////////forum, his post was not deleted and he is allowed back on anytime by contacting me.

*I am offering a 200 dollar bootcamp , that includes stay at project orlando for over TEN days, including the convention time. The hotel itself costs more than that. The bootcamp is full, and will likely be a one time deal. I have put over 100 hours of labor into this convention and charging guys to live at my house for over a week and sarge with me and slikk is not malicious in any way shape or form.

*You flamed me on my own forum, what do you expect me to do?

*Most of the *under 21's best* turned out to be total keyboard jockeys (surprise surprise). Most of the "sinister sixx" are KJs. That includes yourself sheek.

* This convention is happening, we are packed to the max at 50 + a waiting list, and have an awesome set of speakers. People like Mehow, myself, Volatile from Miami seduction , and MYSTERY himself on thursday if everything goes according to plan, on top of a few other awesome guys.

But hey im sure itll suck... Take sheeks word for it.

Go play with your keynote kid.

-Dream

*

Who wants to change their abilities with women and dating FOREVER?

[Telly]

As someone who has been looking forward to this convention for some time now I would like to say I am disgusted. Sheek you should be ashamed you sound like a little baby and I do not like the fact that you guys could not work out your problems so this convention could go on and instead resorted to immature drama.

I wasn't looking forward to you guys as speakers anyways. You were going to "share things that would rock the foundations of the under-21 community". Give me a break. Seriously the greatness of this whole deal was that a bunch of people that know about pickup were going to hang out and talk pick up then go out and sarge together.

I can't believe you used the word scandal about some stupid problem that someone had in a forum.

This Dynamic guy has nothing to do with the convention and it doesn't matter why Dream kicked him out of his house thats his own business.

If people want to pay Dream for a bootcamp that is also his business.

Also you never met dream in real life and you are talking about his one lay like hes a loser. I didn't read it myself but that Rewok post sounds pretty dick. All the LRs BJrs and advice you have ever posted means nothing when I see you in real life anyway. Its not hard to tell if someone is legit.

Work your shit out or something and Dream hang in there man people still want to do this keep up your hard work. As for me, I'm going to be chilling with Mystery while the sinister six hom0s are going to be at home typing their newsletters lol.

I'm just shocked how you could be so ridiculous in this whole self improvement environment. I had better expectations for people with such knowledge. What has happened here in this thread sounds like what would happen if a typical group of highschoolers were to plan such an event.

Who wants to change their abilities with women and dating FOREVER?

[Sheek]

Yet another thread trying to discredit myself and the convention. He even made it in the wrong forum (would have had a lot more views in the main forum buddy).

I just skimmed over this and will respond to anything I feel fit.

*Ive done basically all of the planning work single handedly. This forum we made helped a little but its been basically all of my effort.

*Sheek your a drama queen.

*You, vincent chase, and rewok, had nothing to do with the website. You had months to work on it and ultimatley some guy I work with did it, and then Hawt fixed it up.

*Your twisting shit and adding/removing certain parts, kind of like the media.

*If anyone has any questions about "dynamic" read savoys blog , or just ask him via pm. Dynamic is a con artist. Hence he was fired for posting fake LRs and student reviews.

*Rewok was banned for stirring up trouble on www.under21convention.com/forum, his post was not deleted and he is allowed back on anytime by contacting me.

*I am offering a 200 dollar bootcamp , that includes stay at project orlando for over TEN days, including the convention time. The hotel itself costs more than that. The bootcamp is full, and will likely be a one time deal. I have put over 100 hours of labor into this convention and charging guys to live at my house for over a week and sarge with me and slikk is not malicious in any way shape or form.

*You flamed me on my own forum, what do you expect me to do?

*Most of the *under 21's best* turned out to be total keyboard jockeys (surprise surprise). Most of the "sinister sixx" are KJs. That includes yourself sheek.

* This convention is happening, we are packed to the max at 50 + a waiting list, and have an awesome set of speakers. People like Mehow, myself, Volatile from Miami seduction , and MYSTERY himself on thursday if everything goes according to plan, on top of a few other awesome guys.

But hey im sure itll suck... Take sheeks word for it.

Go play with your keynote kid.

-Dream

*

Hey look dude, I wasn't here to flame you personally. I made my post to shed light on the convention and make sure people think HARD before plopping down thousands to attend the convention. All right, I'll admit, I'm a drama queen.

And then your ass came along and decided to call me a keyboard jockey. AND you had to insult my keynote. I cry at night because KeyNote won't work on my Mac, and here you are, insulting it.

Furthermore, you had the balls to call me a Keyboard jockey. Now personally, I don't like the term. If you haven't noticed, I have around 1,000 posts on this forum. 750 of those are probably responses to threads to the effect of "lol, good post." 200 are probably making fun of Legion5. And the last 50 are probably constructive, intelligent posts that I had written to be such, for which I am acknowledged on the internetz.

You also have some cool posts, I guess. Like the peacocking guide, where you post pictures of yourself in pink sunglasses and talk about how girls love you for it. And then they post "omg this guy's such a creep, he kept on wanting to take pics of us non stop.." on your myspace. But hey, that's to be expected, right? I mean, you're alpha and everything.

Before you call anybody a keyboard jockey, remember that you've been laid by one girl. Once. After prom. You've done close to 2,000 cold approaches and you've yet to lay once of them. Like I said before, your chances of meeting a girl that will fuck you is about 5 times lower than meeting a girl who has AIDS. But hey, it's a numbers game, right? What do I know, I'm a keyboard jockey. I get more than anyone I know, but it doesn't count, because I'm not a superPUA like you. Damn it, being a KJ really sucks.

In all seriousness, I think you're letting this "lolz im so alfaaa" mentality get to you. You can't see past your own ego. Everybody's deserting you, dude. All of the presenters you had lined up for your convention are out. People you had living in your house said fuck it and packed up. Instead of blaming it on the "haters," maybe you should realise it's you who's fucking up.

- Sheek

Who wants to change their abilities with women and dating FOREVER?

[zine]

I hate drama...

this is retarded
i'll be there, love ya both.

you guys need to stop bein so reactive to each other. It is like highschool, granted some of you are in highschool, but real respect is gained through acts not drama. All alpha males are leaders, real leaders do not participate or encourage drama. Be what you want, I'm goin to bed now.

lata,
Zine

[Rip]

For all this drama: I scraped going to the convention.
Done.
I'm not going to go for the potential reason of dissapointment.
To be honest, either one of you could be exaggerating.
I'm not going to blow a ton of money to find out who.

And sorry antman [dream], but I don't see any of your speakers owning up to their showing on this thread.

-Rip

PS - I'd think it's more of a sargefest than a bootcamp ...?

Who wants to change their abilities with women and dating FOREVER?

[Legion5]

I've read over this thread from about 6 angles and honestly I can't make sense of any of it. Finally, it gave me a vibe that reminded me of all of the 16 year old girls I've sarged.

I'm not trying to AMOG anyone or put anything into a negative light.

But there is a deep lack of perception in both Sheek and Dream's posts.

Call it immaturity and that's great because immaturity doesn't really relate to success pickup, but unfortunately immaturity may cause huge issues in event planning.

Dream is wrong because he makes big unsubstantiated claims. This is his failing.

Sheek is wrong because he is a little too robotic about facts. (think social robot here, instead of judging the whole of the situation he judges it in only parts, the facts of it, like Dreams single lay, much like a social robot only acts out parts of a good interaction but cannot reach further into the relm of realness.)

Both of the above flaws are great traits to have in society filled with anonymity and disorganized information, where substantiation and judging of information is difficult. And in a society that is also dominated by logical concrete things. Many of which like Global Warming now evoke images and emotion rather than fact.

My point is both of these issues, and MORE that are present as a result of this immaturity which I get a feeling for, are not something that should be present among friends.

Clearly Skeek has already blown out Dream and Dream has blown out everyone who doesn't agree with him .

So therefore there shouldn't be a reconciliation, but under ideal conditions, it would be cool if Sheek went back to doing the introductions under good faith, and Dream included more people in his whole gig.

Anyway even though I have extensively talked about the above that is actually not the point of my post, you'll notice next to my user name that I don't list my Age. I do this so that I can come across as more neutral, but also to have my first impression be as such. My first impression is naturally something I should be congruent with, so therefore I am what I seem, and that is neutral, which is a small goal I have. Miaaddict has a similar result, however I'm now going to point out that I am also under 21. 20 to be precise.

Also because during the summer I frequently do ocean sports and race cars in an amateur league on the East Coast, I'm in Florida and especially Daytona/Miami frequently.

This makes the U21C a semi big part of my opportunities, and being part of that, I want it to be the best it can be. So... this isn't about two people, this is about the U21C.

So let's go back to talking about 16 year old girls for a sec. Well. I find, as well as with many other examples all around the country before this statement will show, that Immaturity can really only be solved by one method.

Chaperones.

Therefore, in my interest and the interest of the flat out best community event in my opinion since the Cliff convention. (and best for widely different reasons too.)

Seriously, I think you guys need to casually get some one like Hysteria or Tenmagnet to give a once over to your work and plans. They're not hard to reach and having them on board would be a decent idea.

Just do it.

[Rewok]

Let me preface this by saying that yes, me and Dream have had significant drama and fallings out. Some people just don't get along; I hold no grudges.

Also, let me say that my post on U21 was an attempt to make sure he didn't trick anyone, but also to put the least spin on it that I physically could. I messed up. *Shrug* I've been contacted by Dream a couple times to be let back in to there and TDL, but I have declined because I know it would only lead to trouble on my part.

I wholeheartedly STILL endorse the convention.

And am very upset that Sheek wrote this, but I won't go into too much detail there. Even though I have the most drama with Dream, the convention was a great idea; and shouldn't be subject to personal vendetta.

I, personally, would've loved to go. Chilling for a week in Florida hanging out with the cool people who show up, and helping a couple kids step up as well as learning a lot was plenty incentive for me. Unfortunatly, due to some financial mishaps recentlly I am unable to go. Hell, me going down to Florida to chill with Orleans and Sheek was plenty motivation for me. For $20, I'll pay to sit in air conditioning and shoot the shit.

Yes, I brought a lot of members attention to U21; but I wasn't the one who made the actual sale of it. People didn't stay because of ANYONE. They stayed because in theory the convention was REDICULOUSLLY AWESOME, and the fact that it turned out this way is a very sad one indeed.

Also, the Sinister Sixx are in NO WAY SHAPE OR FORM INVOLVED IN THIS PENIS MEASURING CONTEST, NOR DO WE ADVOCATE GOING TO OR PULLING OUT OF THIS CONVENTION. Bringing up the Sixx in this thread was awful PR on your part Sheek, and you need to learn to seperate business from personal.

If you really want to measure dicks on the internet; mines 8.5", so theres a 97.5% chance its bigger than both of yours, look it up.

The final word is this:

-The U21 Convention is a great idea for anyone who wants to have some fucking fun. I wish I was still going, and I currentlly hate speeding tickets for stealing my plane money.

- The Sheek / Dream vendetta has NOTHING TO DO WITH THE CONVENTION, nor does how many lays Dream has. If Bill Gates never got laid in his LIFE he would still be a fucking billionaire; because he could package and sell a great product.

- The Sinister Sixx are NOT involved with this at all. The Sixx do NOT support RSD over TMM or VA; are NOT planning on releasing products, and are NOT hosting a rival convention. The only relation the Sixx and this whole fiasco have is me and Sheek, and I am currentlly chastising Sheek for opening his mouth about us in this context.

As for this issue, I truly hope it can be resolved. I've kept in touch with many of the members I've seen go to the website, and am STILL pumping the convention. For 20$, you can't physically go wrong. It could be a donkey humping a woman on stage and I'd just go "Hey. Welcome to Tiajuana" light up a stogie and pound some tequilla.

Daddy Loves You Both
-Rewok

[Vincent Chase]

Play nice boys, or I'll act.

[Heartwork]

I think Rewoks Post really summed everything up.

There has been drama but it does not have affect this convention. And has nothing to do with the convention.

The only reason I may not be down there is because of unforseen events and family matters but if shit clears up you will see me at this convention.

The Convention is great and I know this will not be the last one, I still support it in the fullest.